VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

Donna · Posted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 9:00 am Post subject: Punch n' Roll n' Sound Forge?

I really really really don't want to have to get PoTools, but unless I can figure out an easy and/or elegant way to punch and roll with SF, that's what's gonna happen.

Anybody using SF in this way?
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georgethetech · Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:02 am Post subject:

Is this because ACX says you have to?
No, SF can't do it...
Not a believer in this technique for VO actors, only for VO engineers.
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heyguido · Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:18 am Post subject:

Editing in post is a lot easier, and a lot more consistent. Keep rolling.
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Bish · Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:56 am Post subject:

+1 for editing in post. Just keep that recorder running through the session and correct as you catch yourself. The biggest time saver I found was to visibly mark the bad takes as you go... I give it three healthy lip-smacks to clearly mark the waveform where I'm doing a re-read. My first edit sweep is to take out the offending stuff prior to the markers. I have tried various methods, but generally I find that anything that makes me have to play with the "mechanics" during the read just breaks my flow and takes me out of the book/script.

ACX has no prerequisites for this (and if either is done properly, how would they know?) ... they outline each method in their documentation, opining that punch and roll is faster and more efficient. Maybe it is for some, but not for me.
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todd ellis · Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:46 am Post subject:

i'm a "let 'er roll and get it later" kind of guy too.
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Donna · Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:52 am Post subject:

I've been experimenting with stopping starting and I agree, it wrecks the flow of the piece. What seems to be working right now is a 'clicker' designed for horse or dog training. It makes a big ol' spike in the wave form so I can zero in on it quickly. Plus, for some reason, it makes me salivate.

Roll on, you crazy diamond!
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heyguido · Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:52 am Post subject:

I think it was Kafer who suggested the "clicker".....

Brilliant idea! Just "click,click" and pick up at the most logical point. Keeps your head in the read, and it's easy to find after the fact.

Picked mine up at register @ Petsmart. Yep, I got paws paddin' 'round my place, too.... Wink

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todd ellis · Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:54 am Post subject:

we've talked about the "click" method several times - i use it - although i "snap" instead.
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cyclometh · Posted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:43 am Post subject:

+1 for the clicker. I use a PetSmart dog clicker- $1.65 and one of the most useful tools in my editing arsenal.

I've been working on some streamlined editing techniques, once I get them perfected look for some blog posts on it.
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ChrisMezzolesta · Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 7:14 pm Post subject:

Hi, this is a new idea in an old thread!! But this came up when I was looking up Donna's same exact question. What you can also do, if you have the keyboard in with you and the CPU outside, is to hit the M key which will insert a marker in the waveform. You can click it, snap to it, or hit a key to "go to" a certain marker. If the region between 2 markers is all fluff, you can doubleclick to select that region and delete it.

Sometimes I do that, particularly for long scripts broken up into, say, slides or something, so I can edit within each slide then pull em out of the master file to a new final file per slide...and yes I also do the CLICK method, works every time.

Greetings from the future....
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Jason Huggins · Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 7:55 pm Post subject:

I personally prefer the punch and roll, but I don't have difficulty (after I did an audiobook this way) switching from the technical to the creative mind and back. I have a feeling that is atypical.

For recording, I use Presonus Studio One. They have a free, full-featured version that doesn't expire. It gives you the ability to punch and roll just like ProTools. (Place the cursor at the beginning of the sentence that needs to be redone, hit record, software preroll plays a couple seconds, you pick up where you left off). Studio One also has a great feature where, if you mess up after a a punch, you can just hit Command+Z and it will reset your cursor to where you started the punch. Then I export to Adobe Audition for editing.

No harm in trying it out. I'd recommend doing a few pages of a book straight, then a few pages with punch and roll, then edit them both, and listen to your performance. If you notice a lack of acting in the punch and roll section, ditch it and just record straight. If it sounds the same, you can save yourself a lot of time.

I think that I really comes down to your ability to switch between technical and creative. If that is a difficult transition, your acting performance will suffer greatly by using punch and roll. You are trying to play engineer and talent.

For anything less than 20 pages or so, I make a mouth click too, I just pop my tongue.

georgethetech · Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:14 pm Post subject:

If you want a fixed length automatic Pre-Roll, that's impossible to simulate with SoundForge or TwistedWave, but just punch-n-roll can be done to an extent just by engaging record during playback at the point where you want to start recording, and removing the junk leftover at the end of the file.

Jason and I are totally in sync on this topic. Punch and Roll takes practice to do it seamlessly without disrupting your acting flow. If you can nail it you'll save production time/make more $$. Chris's technique I find to be very efficient as well. One of these days we need to do a shootout, but it's a case by case, person by person basis. I desperately tried to get Studio One Free to work on my Mac, but all I see in the Song Setup window is this:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pd185ehv0h143jx/Presonus_StudioOne-problem.png

Reaper, on the other hand, works great for punch and roll.
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If it sounds good, it is good.
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ConnieTerwilliger · Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 9:43 pm Post subject:

I like punch and roll when I have an engineer doing the session - me perched on a lovely stool with a bottle of water, my script, my pencil and my headphones - listening to the director interject on occasion as I read a lovingly crafted script.

Wait - in what universe does that happen anymore?

I am a snapper - always have been able to snap. Used to drive the editors mad when I was a producer - snap, snap, snap, Make the edit "there!" SNAP.
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Jason Huggins · Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 10:32 pm Post subject:

Studio One has some quirks in setup. It took me a while to get it working, but now it plays very nicely with my iMac. And it has the PERFECT price tag for testing (free). There are some settings that have to be wiggled around to get the punch and roll to work effectively. I'd be happy to chat if anyone needs the help.

captain54 · Lucky 700 Joined: 30 Jan 2006 Posts: 744 Location: chicago

Engaging RECORD in Twisted Wave to re-do a gaffe doesn't destroy the old recording, just shuttles it over.. I can't figure out how to do this in Sound Forge. Possible?