VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

heyguido · Posted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:38 pm Post subject:

EEEEEEEWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!

Gasp

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Don Brookshire
"Wait.... They wanna PAY me for this?"

JoeActor · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:47 am Post subject:

Jason Huggins · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:52 am Post subject:

Does that mean, Joe, that you know multiple Yiddish phrases?

JoeActor · Posted: Fri Dec 21, 2012 10:08 am Post subject:

Steven Lowell · Joined: 16 Dec 2010 Posts: 13

I hope its ok for me to speak here...Regarding that question, I want to speak objectively. You need to know that if you are a beginner, you will go up against professionals on both sites, just like offline.

SO...You need to always hold yourself to the highest standards. Before spending money on any site, or auditioning, make sure you know how to:

Read copy/act as well as the people on this thread
Communicate online (ie. Send an email to get results)
Understand audio quality
Operate as a small online business
Use a website to make clients hiring...want you (ie. save them time.)
Market yourself outside the websites

You really cant compare sites because both are great and stink for reasons you have to find out for yourself. There are things that make them different internally, which you may be attracted to, but that just means you are attracted to the way the owner/staff decided to run the business or build the website. Still, opinions and experiences vary so greatly, it's hard to talk about. These are "people driven" websites, after all.

Personally, I used both for a couple of years (05-07). After working at Voice123, I realized what makes both sites different, and why it has 0% to do with getting work. I will say, unlike 5 years ago, it is harder for anyone to get started online. Each professional talent is an online business, and most are dug in pretty deep by now, and have their own client lists built through the website. Whatever you do...just don't think you have to lower yourself to get work. It's a "tell" that you are a beginner. Make business decisions now, that you plan on making in 10 or 20 years. Smile

oh...Which one should you use? My take is...Your auditions will show up in the audition inbox of the very people you write to online. If you feel ready for that, then use both. If that makes you uncomfortable...train more until that feeling goes away.

Philip Banks · Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 2:12 am Post subject:

EVERY new VO believes that he or she can launch a career by doing exactly the same thing as the VOs already out there in the market. Most of the VOs out there in the market believe that they can maintain or take their careers to the next level by doing exactly the same thing as the other VOs out there in the market.

YOU CAN'T
THEY CAN'T

Now,2013 and on you really have to think and act differently in every part of your business.

If you're looking for financial success there are 101 things you can do in order to increase the possibility of it coming your way.

One thing to guard against - Advice from the self-proclaimed VO experts. Sadly, the majority simply know more than the person they are teaching and just about earn a living. That does not make them bad people, just not the people to advise you free or paid.

P2P sites have all sorts of numbers to entice new members, that's their business, to extract money from VO people. If you were to ask XYZ123.com the question "Out of your 5678 members how many made at leat $1,500?" I doubt you would get an answer. The claim would be something like "well we don't want our competition to get that information". Their competition already has that information! Like every avenue open to VOs in this business 95% of people do not make a penny ..ever.

Question - Today you are launching yourself on the road to VO heaven. how much money over two years can you afford to lose? That's the investment risk.

Steven Lowell · Joined: 16 Dec 2010 Posts: 13

Amen Philip.
My guard has been up against self-proclaimed experts since the mid-90's.

Every business is the largest. Everyone is an expert. Everyone is professional, and we all say the same things to sell ourselves or our business, which many times involves saying, "Dont use them, use me.". But the one person we listen to that clicks, and helps us get work, is usually the one we attach to ourselves. To think one can get around the ways in which we "campaign to create want" is to believe one is above human nature.

There really are no experts, only specialists in certain areas. Mine happens to be the place where I have been working the last 5 years, which was a choice I made to educate myself because I don't trust random opinions found through Google searches. Now, I can explain what happens here because this is the part of the business I know: Real numbers...

2007 - There were 4000 premium members were on 123
2008 to 2009 - It dropped to 3300 and back up to 3900.
2010 to present - Grew to 4200

Voice123 is 86% US/Canadian, 4% UK, 2% Spanish and the 8% leftover is scattered internationally (bilingual English and something else).

During that time, I found that only 10% of the 4200 were able to use websites as a career. I also found that 35% of the 4200 people on 123...never booked a job from the site.

Out of the 65%, I have no idea who made $1500, but I do know at least 1000-2000 of them did. Why? Because I have answered feedback emails for 5 years, seen stats on who renews, probably heard over a million demos and auditions, and we are talking about a VERY small group of people. You get to know people very fast. The whole thing reminded me what I already heard offline...

Cream rises to the top.
A very small percentage of people can do this full-time.
A large percentage are hobbyists or never book work.

This is nothing I did not know already. Years ago, I was told, "Keep two jobs." So I did. I found I can stay in the business by doing VO's and helping others get work. I also went to college, pursued acting, did theatre, on-camera, etc. That's the path I took. I had a teacher who explained, "You can stay in this business if you want to, but you have to know the risks, and decide "is this what I really want?".

At 123, I have seen lots of good, nice people (pro and new) come and go, who wanted to try, but last a year and didnt like it. Still, that ballpark 4200 number still sticks. Why? Depending on your demographic, you may face less competition. The toughest online market is male, US-English, age 30- 50. You just cant buy your way in, even if a website or Internet seems to offer endless opportunity. There are thousands of real jobs on Linkedin too. It doesnt mean you will get one if you submit a million resumes. Right now, there are about 1000 people who never audition and just pay to use the search feature on 123 as part of their marketing plan or a tax write off. Info about how websites operate is always skewed because people stop using websites at certain times for certain reasons. Websites change policies and staff. So, you may be getting info from someone who hasn't used a P2P in years, or someone who quit yesterday. Usually the info is relevant to the time that person stopped using the website. I realize that websites change so fast, that anyone who has been away from one for a while, may not be the best person to ask. I only say that because I have been very open about what happens here, and phrases like, "We don't want our competition to know" sound like things I heard years ago. I can imagine who said it too.

One thing I don't talk about is who books the most work and how much they make...for one single reason: Voice talent pay to use the website to get work. They signed no agreement that states I must divulge their personal information because a complete stranger wants reassurance the website is legit. I do believe in 2013 that somethings should remain private. I booked an on-camera job years ago that aired during the Super Bowl. The next thing I knew, everyone wanted to know how much I was paid. Maybe I am old fashioned, but I believe it is rude to talk about how much money a person makes. It's personal business.

Anyways, I will always tell you straight up truth in my own way, only because I am over the fact that this is a hard business, and I am sure you will find out why. I have come to realize that regardless of what I think or say, people only listen when they are ready to listen. I don't rain on parades, but I will pass out umbrellas.

Peace and happy holidays!
Steven

Bish · Posted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 7:58 pm Post subject:

Steven, thank you for being so open and discussing the business with some hard figures and candid opinions. It's refreshing to hear straight talk from the inside, rather than having to wade through multiple layers of obfuscation and corporate-speak.
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Bish a.k.a. Bish
Smoke me a kipper... I'll be back for breakfast.
I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls.

Limerick Lane Audio · Contributore Level V Joined: 13 Jan 2012 Posts: 151

Michael Schoen · Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 1:43 pm Post subject:

Good job Steve L.
Appreciate your perspective and candor.
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