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Web guru help needed, please.
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Don G.
King's Row


Joined: 11 Nov 2004
Posts: 1071
Location: MA

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 8:10 am    Post subject: Web guru help needed, please. Reply with quote

I have a situation for which I could use the resident web guru's brain trust's help. It's been a problem for a while, but when I get busy I forget about it. I remembered it again when it came time to post my butchered BBC spot.

In a nutshell, the problem is the way my audio files play (or rather, don't play). I upload an .mp3 file to my server and when someone enters the url, the window opens with the small QT player, but the playhead zips right to the end of the file after playing only a few seconds of audio, if any. This happens for me in Firefox, but not it Safari, where it plays okay. I have the exact same problem trying to play the files on my computer at work, using Firefox. However, as an experiment I uploaded the exact same file to my personal web space on my Comcast account and it played okay for me from there in Firefox.

I asked my web host about the problem and their response was: I'm listening to the mp3 file now ... I'm not able to duplicate this on windows OR linux - in firefox. I have no way of testing it in Internet Explorer. [snip] Sorry - can't help you any further if I can't replicate the issue. I've had 3 people here try and none have had the problem.

The same thing happens on my web site with my demos, which causes real concern because of an apparent inability for potential clients to hear them.

I mentioned it to my site designer and he had a similar issue, stating I checked out the demos on your site with my PC and they only worked properly in one browser. It's called SlimBrowser and it's my browser of choice because it offers many more features than IE. IE played the clips, but for some reason they seemed to play in RealPlayer instead of QuickTime. SlimBrowser played them in QuickTime. Firefox played them in QuickTime, but did what you described - played only a portion of the clip and the play head just zipped right across.

FWIW, here's a link to the file at my own domain. And here's the same file at my Comcast site.

I'm at a loss and would appreciate any input from folks in the know. If it's a problem with the host, I'll need to start looking for a new one, although I hope it's not, as I've been very pleased with them thus far. If not the host, then what? Thanks in advance.
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glittlefield
M&M


Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 2039
Location: Round Rock, TX

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don, I'm at the office and using IE7 and both files worked OK for me. They each opened in Windows Media Player and played fine.

I used the portable version of Firefox (2.0.0.6), however and only got the first two seconds of the file on your domain. The file on your Comcast site downloaded OK and played with the Quicktime plug-in.

In Firefox, I switched the default media player to Windows Media Player and both files downloaded and played OK at full length in WMP.

I'm putting the evil eye on the Firefox/Quicktime relationship.
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Greg Littlefield
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ricevoice
Cinquecento


Joined: 28 Dec 2007
Posts: 532
Location: Sacramento, CA

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fwiw, in Internet Explorer the file from your Comcast plays fine, but the file from your site is only :01 long.
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Chris Rice - Noisemaker
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louzucaro
The Gates of Troy


Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 1915
Location: Chicago area

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Don,

There are a couple different things contributing...

First off, I'm on Vista, and both files on both domains played perfectly, exactly as you'd expect them to using IE7, which, on my system, opened them with Windows Media Player.

Keep in mind that Windows allows the user to choose (through file associations) which program "handles" which type of file. The nasty part of this is that just about any program you install that CAN play a file type is going to want to assert itself as your program of choice to play that file.

So on a "fresh" Windows system, MP3 files will automatically be played by Windows Media Player, which does a fine job of streaming MP3s from online sources, so long as the online source in question is capable of it in terms of the bandwidth of the site / bitrate of the file.

(I also downloaded the two files...it downloaded about 3x to 4x faster from the Comcast site than from yours, but this difference in speed wasn't enough to be noticeable when I just clicked on the links in your message...as I said, they both played fine)

But then if you install QuickTime, it wants to play all MP3 files, so it may give you the option of having it NOT do so, but many people just keep clicking "OK" during installation, allowing programs to take over playing of various file types.

Then if you install the RealPlayer, it wants to control all your media.

And so on and so forth.

So, depending on what programs an individual has installed, what options they've agreed to, not agreed to, etc., and what browser they use to access the web and what plugins that browser uses (if any) and whether or not they work, well, now you've got a situation where many users will have many different user experiences.

This is one of the main reasons why Flash players for both audio and video have become so widely used of late, because the Flash player will play your media right on your web page, as opposed to requiring the use of another application on the user's computer.

And since Flash is cross-platform, cross-browser, etc., there are generally no compatibility issues.

I say "generally" because different versions of the Flash plugin have different bugs, so you could have a situation where 99% of everybody can play your stuff fine, but that 1% that has an outdated Flash plugin may have trouble with it (I've had this happen on client sites before).
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Lou Zucaro
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ricevoice
Cinquecento


Joined: 28 Dec 2007
Posts: 532
Location: Sacramento, CA

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been thinking about a Flash player for my site when I re-do it this summer just because it seems like it would be easier for people to not have to open files in another aHobo Tounge. It never occured to me that different browsers would have compatibility issues with the downloadable files. Looks like I'll definitely be going the Flash route... thanks for the info, Lou!

Oh, and Don... when it only showed up as a :01 second file for me, it was through IE with Windows Media Player on XP/Media Center.
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Chris Rice - Noisemaker
www.ricevoice.com
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Don G.
King's Row


Joined: 11 Nov 2004
Posts: 1071
Location: MA

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks so much for all the replies thus far.

What struck me as odd is that whenever anyone posts audio files here for critique or these fun experiments, they always play fine for me in QuickTime. When my own files don't, it seems particularly odd.

So, assuming my new web site will have its own .mp3 player on it (it will), is there anything I can do so that I can be certain that any .mp3 files I upload will play okay for everyone? Or should I just assume they will, and that if they don't it's a problem on the user's end? But if that's the case, how can the exact same file play differently from the different domains, as Greg and Chris experienced?

Lastly, and perhaps most importantly, is it safe to assume this is not a problem with my host? If I don't have to look for another, I'd rather not.

Thanks again.


Last edited by Don G. on Fri May 16, 2008 9:57 am; edited 1 time in total
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louzucaro
The Gates of Troy


Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 1915
Location: Chicago area

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 9:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do you mean when you say that your new site will have its own MP3 player? Do you mean you're going to use a Flash audio player on the new site?

If that's the case, based on what I saw from your host currently, you shouldn't have to worry about switching hosts so long as your audio files' bitrates aren't too high (the one you have up there now is just fine).
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Lou Zucaro
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"Well, yeah, there's my favorite leaf!"
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Don G.
King's Row


Joined: 11 Nov 2004
Posts: 1071
Location: MA

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry. Yes, it will have a Flash audio player.

But in terms of just uploading an audiofile to my site for folks here (or wherever) to play and listen, how can I be certain it will work properly? It's a fairly straightforward procedure and it worked in the past, but not now apparently.

Right now at work, I just tried playing from the links I posted earlier, and the one hosted on my site plays only the first few seconds while the one hosted at the Comcast site plays the whole file. This is frustrating.
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Eddie Eagle
M&M


Joined: 23 Apr 2008
Posts: 2393

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It may be in the HTML for the page it's on or your website. Make sure to have a string that allows you to view the page from any browser. This link has a discussion that may help.
http://www.frontpagewebmaster.com/m-369847/tm.htm#369847
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louzucaro
The Gates of Troy


Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 1915
Location: Chicago area

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 12:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eddie, your link is a good reference, but it's more related to pages as a whole rather than something specific like an audio file.

Don, at work, are you on XP? Vista? What browser are you using?

Just uploading a file and having it playable as an MP3 (without making it available through a Flash player) will subject it to all of the stuff I wrote about in my earlier post...the user experience will depend on their system, what aHobo Tounge is responsible for playing MP3s, how well that aHobo Tounge streams data, etc. etc. etc.
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Lou Zucaro
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ccpetersen
With a Side of Awesome


Joined: 19 Sep 2007
Posts: 3708
Location: In Coherent

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lou,

I've had a similar problem with Flash on my website... it would load the whole thing, then zip through it and stop. It happened with firefox AND IE, but not safari, and only with one file. I haven't figured out why... still working on that. I've tried reassociating files, etc... no luck. If I ever figure it out, I'll probably get rich, since other people gripe about it too...
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Don G.
King's Row


Joined: 11 Nov 2004
Posts: 1071
Location: MA

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lou, sorry, but I'm just now getting a chance to check this thread again. At work (and at home), I'm using Macs and on the two I tried here (a Mini and an eMac) using Firefox, the problem still occurs. However, I also checked a couple of other files posted by others in that BBC thread, and they all play fine in Firefox. Grrrrr...

The most interesting thing to me is that my site has been up for a couple of years in this incarnation, and back then, the demos played fine. It's one thing not to be able to upload files to play the fun talent games here on the forum, but quite another to think that clients aren't able to hear the demos on my web site.

And by the way, thanks for your patience and all your help thus far with this madness.
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Lizden
A Zillion


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Posts: 8864
Location: The dark recesses of my mind

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don,
Sorry to be late...
FYI
I clicked on the fist link (your domain) and it brought up Windows Media Player...and played for :02 Lips Are Sealed
I clicked the OTHER link from Comcast and it played in Windows Media Player just fine Smile

I'm on an older PC running Win. 2000 Pro, & IE6

Hope this helps in some small way....

Liz
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Eddie Eagle
M&M


Joined: 23 Apr 2008
Posts: 2393

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, I'm using the latest Firefox and on an XP system if that helps. I too had it zip through on the 1st link and play fine on the comcast. That's why I thought it may be the type of browsers your site or page is being id'd and playing incorrectly by Firefox. I had a similar issue with my site before only it was how the pages looked on a screen when viewed from IE and Firefox. The www3. type doc is supposed to let any type of browser translate the codes on a site.

Are you using a java code on that page or another markup?
I just checked out your other demos and they all do the same thing with Firefox. Sounds like a FFBug. I checked it out on IE and it worked ok.

I emailed a bit of code as it won't post on the board because the board is code sensitive. It works with all browsers.
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louzucaro
The Gates of Troy


Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 1915
Location: Chicago area

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An img link won't work properly with an audio file, as the browser expects an image there to display, and not to pass the audio off to the user's media player.

CC, do you have a link to that one you're having an issue with?

Don, if I have time later, I'll do a little mockup for you and you can see if you have better luck with it the way I'm gonna set it up.
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Lou Zucaro
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"Well, yeah, there's my favorite leaf!"
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