VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

kjedlicka

Hello all,

I don't post much, but read the forum every day. I have been doing part-time VO for a few years, but still consider myself very much the noob.

There are some questions related to home studio recording to which I just cannot find the answers. They seem like "duh" questions, but still, I cannot find the answers or the right techniques.

First question is related to noise floor and background noise. I've heard that -70 db is preferable, and my ears would agree. SaVoa says -40 db is acceptable, but that seems quite noisy to me. That is where the problem lies. I have a (used) WhisperRoom, 4x6, walls lined with the standard 2" foam that came with it, plus Auralex bass traps floor-to-ceiing in all corners, no cloud. I am using a MXL 909, through a MicPort Pro, into a MacBook Pro.

I have the mic gain on the MicPort Pro set at about 75, or at 3 o'clock on the gain knob (7 o'clock is "min," 5 o'clock is "max"). This setting has my voice peaking between -10 and -6 db, but my noise floor is -50 db. The only way I can drop my noise floor to -70 db is to turn down my mic pre, which puts my voice in the -30 to - 26 db range - way too low.

That is the only question I'm going to ask today. It took me weeks to muster the guts to ask what seems like such a rank noob question. Thank you all for your help.

Keith

todd ellis · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 9:43 am Post subject:

SOMETHING in your chain is causing all that noise. the good news is - you have a short chain. start eliminating stuff one at a time until you find it - shouldn't be too difficult. if you post an audio sample one of the brainiacs here will surely be able to help.
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Jeffrey Kafer · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 9:57 am Post subject:

I don't know who at Savoa says that -40db is acceptable, but they're wrong.
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asnively · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 11:07 am Post subject:

SaVoa says -40 db is acceptable? Wow. That's weird.
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Frank F · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 11:21 am Post subject:

Let's begin with the basics.

Many of the MXL microphones are nice for VO, but have a lot of "self-noise". The 909 fits in that category. Although it is stated as a cardoid pattern microphone, the actual pickup pattern is more omni-directional.

I am not going to go through all the techno-babble to explain this but I will suggest you consider lowering the gain in the MicPortPro, and increasing the gain inside the computer - either on the M Hobo Tounge

controls or PC mixer.

Another USB cable (a usual noise suspect) might be a first choice swap out.

This next thought relates to the recording environment itself. What is being used for a mic holder - a boom stand, a boom arm, etc.? Is it well isolated/de-coupled?

Is there internal computer noise (fan, other electronic noise seeping inside the waveform, etc.)? This may be checked by turning off or unplugging the microphone and M Hobo Tounge

from the computer and recording a small segment. The result will be displayed in the waveform.

What to do about the noise floor? That will depend upon the results from the previous suggestions - and many more to come, I am sure.

A noise floor of -40 db is acceptable?????? It looks like we need to have a lo-o-o-o-ng chat with the boys and girls at SaVoa.

Frank F
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Deirdre · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 11:37 am Post subject:

It's always the cables.
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Lance Blair · M&M Joined: 03 Jun 2007 Posts: 2281 Location: Atlanta

I don't think they say a noise floor of -40 is acceptable, I thought they mean that the gap between your average recording level and your noise floor can be -40dbFS. But that's still kind of high. If you're recording at -20 avg. your floor can be at -60dbFS. Don't quote me on this, but I think that's what they were getting at.

An 80Hz HPF (High Pass Filter) somewhere in the chain even if it's software-created should get you to -60dbFS. BTW, I think it's good to record with peaks -18 to -12.
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kjedlicka · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 11:57 am Post subject:

Thanks everyone for the responses. SaVoa lists a cumulative noise floor of -40 dbfs or less on the accreditation criteria page on the website.

Frank, I'm using a Mac, and there is no software to increase gain for the M Hobo Tounge

. There is no M Hobo Tounge

driver for the Mac, it just runs through the Sound control panel of the Mac OS, and "The selected device has no input controls," meaning, no gain. I have no other mixer. The M Hobo Tounge

goes straight into the USB port of my laptop.

My audio software is TwistedWave, and its Device preferences just adopts the System preferences.

I'll need to acquire another USB cable to test it. I tried 3 mic cables and got the same result each time.

I didn't mention in my original post, the computer is outside the booth. Inside, it's just the mic, in a shockmount, on a boom stand, a copy stand, the M Hobo Tounge

, and me.

I unplugged the M Hobo Tounge

from the laptop and recorded a small segment; total silence.

So, absent the USB cable issue, I don't know what to think. I do think that it's worth mentioning that I also swapped out the M Hobo Tounge

for an Apogee Duet, same setup as with the M Hobo Tounge

, except it was a FireWire cable connecting the Duet and the laptop - different cable, different mic pre - same results. Although it's possible I have two funky cables, it's not probable.

I don't think my home is particularly noisy and is bleeding that much into the whisperroom. It has to be something I'm doing or not doing...

Last question (this post): is -70 what I am shooting for? Do all of you achieve that noise floor? Or do you have something louder, and reduce with noise reduction or a high-pass filter afterward?

Thanks,
Keith

kjedlicka · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 12:16 pm Post subject:

Lance Blair · M&M Joined: 03 Jun 2007 Posts: 2281 Location: Atlanta

Relax! Don't worry, you'll figure this all out. I take it you don't have a high pass filter in your chain. Do you have AC running in your house? Most offending low rumble in a home is around 40-50Hz, and the 80Hz High Pass (or Low Cut) Filter makes that bearable. It can knock down the noise floor a full 10db or more.
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kjedlicka · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 12:53 pm Post subject:

Lance, no, I don't have a high pass filter in my chain. As you can see, it's pretty rudimentary: mic/cable to MicPort pro to USB to laptop. I don't know what equipment I'd need to employ a high pass filter into the chain. Can I use a high pass filter or noise reduction feature in my software after recording? If so, great, but I'd still like to be able to figure out how to just start with the proper environment...

When I get ready to record, I do the following: shut off AC, shut off ceiling fans, turn off refrigerator in kitchen, as it is against a shared wall. I do this because of the very noticeable hum when those things were on.

Frank F · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 1:05 pm Post subject:

Lance is on the right track. (Yah Lance!).

Cables are a usual culprit, then comes inherent noise. With the M Hobo Tounge

plugged in and the mic "off" record another snippet of sound. What are the results?

IF you see a high noise floor, then it may be assumed (and you know what assuming does???) it's either the M Hobo Tounge

cable or the M Hobo Tounge

itself.

Congrats, you have isolated part of the problem - or not. If you still have the issue, then there is something "turned UP" inside the computers mixer which shouldn't be "UP". Check the mixer settings, make sure all sliders EXCEPT the once used for the M Hobo Tounge

are down or off. Record a snippet again. What are the results?

And, this is just the beginning if the issue is not resolved. Electrical issues within your home (as Lance stated) may be the next thing to review. Wiring, street noise, etc. are all possibilities.

Now, to the -70 db question. We all wish we could achieve a -70 db noise floor with consumer audio equipment in a non-isolated, non decoupled, inexpensive way.

Anything below -60 is acceptable. Keyword being: acceptable. The lower the noise floor, the better. But do not strive for an unreachable goal. Do the best you can with the money, time, equipment, and skills you have readily available.

D. B. writes: "It's always the cables".

And I say - yep.

Good luck.

Frank F
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Mike Sommer · Posted: Wed May 19, 2010 1:55 pm Post subject:

First, post a sample.

Are you saying your noise is hiss, or what?

In the digital domain recording louder is not always better especially if your getting hiss. All you need to do is get good clean audio in and you can bring up the level in the digital domain.

It may mean simply turning down your Mic Port Pro, and or getting a different preamp.

But until we can hear what's going on we can only guess.
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