VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

[BenWils]

I haven't had a chance to listen to these samples from this link on my studio monitors but this is a very interesting comparison of vintage versus newer technology when it comes to Neumann U87 mics.

I was surprised at the findings and also intrigued at how they went about their test:

http://recordinghacks.com/2011/03/19/neumann-u87ai-vs-u87i/

Check it out.
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Ben


"To be really good at voiceover, you need to improve your footwork and hip snap."

[Mike Sommer]

There findings are pretty much what I have reported on in the past. A U87 and U87Ai are almost identical.

The reviewer said he could hear more air in the vocal tracks but not in the guitar, but it was just the other way around for me. I immediately heard the more open top end on the guitar.

The capsule of an early U87 were PVC, the new capsules are Mylar, which accounts for the darker sound of the original. Also the PVC has a shorter self life than the Mylar. Many older U87 have had new capsules installed, I know of a pair of Original U87's here in LA that are just fantastic- of course a lot of it has to do with the transformers in the mixer too.

But over all, without a side by side comparison you would be hard pressed to hear the difference.

One final note. The electronics in a U87 have seen about 10 changes over the years, but they all sound pretty darn close. Not to bad for hand built mic.
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The Blog:
http://voiceoveraudio.blogspot.com/

Acoustics are counter-intuitive. If one thing is certain about acoustics, it is that if anything seems obvious it is probably wrong.

[Frank F]

Mike's answer is why we have so many different types of microphones available today.

I love my classic U87, I do not the U87AI. To me the AI is still thin on certain types of vocals (female lead soprano/alto; sustained notes in higher pitches, etc.); and hot on numerous instruments including piano, horns, and deep strings (cello, viola, violin, stand-up bass, classical guitar, etc.). The classic U87 was designed as a voiceover/vocal microphone. Yet still today many cannot hear the subtleties of this perennial tool.

Everyone has a unique ear and a unique voice. The only way to compare apples to oranges (in terms of microphones) is to listen with a critical ear and find out what is right for you and your wants and desires for a microphone.

I use an AI sparingly, mostly when recording orchestral groups or large vocal ensembles. I choose not to use an AI for voiceover or for single person vocals. Choose wisely based upon you knowledge and references. Do not assume someone else knows more or less than you for your application(s).

Most opinions (including mine) are worth what you pay for them.

Frank F
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Be thankful for the bad things in life. They opened your eyes to the good things you weren't paying attention to before. email: thevoice@usa.com

[Philip Banks]

Meet Mark. Mark is around the same age as me and a former FM jock culled in the great radio DJ extermination of ..whenever. Mark has great pipes (revolting term). Mark is able to rumble with the stereotypical movie trailer and imaging voices.

After extensive research and using expert advice from the expert experts he bought THE mic, I mean THE MIC ..Wow! The pre which he brought is so much more of a pre than the other Chinese, Peruvian or Pennsylvania Dutch Pre amps. His room was calibrated in an anechoic chamber on a Tibetan mountainside and before he starts work his shirt is the quietest he can find. Body temperature? Mean LA post chauffeured to studio. His ISDN codec was assembed by Bahamian virgins and the leads made by a man in Bodmin, Cornwall from gold, kelp and Osprey wings.

Mark's set up has been A/B blind tested with C/D mirror set ups in a sterile Baltimore Hospital HDU ITU. Perfect.

Mark also can't read to save his life and when I listened to his mutli-billion dollar set up that was the only thing I could hear.

When I listen to Ben on his mic (MKH416 ?) I hear what ben can do and he does it very well. Indeed, neither a U87 or a U87GTI would bring anything to the party other than subtleties which some eejit audio engineer would compress the **** out of.

[Rob Ellis]

to my ear the 87ai can sound a bit underwhelming in proportion to its mythical status; but I voiced a regional spot with one recently and while the dry reads didn't sound like anything special in terms of sound quality, presence, etc., after the post production people did their thing the VO sat perfectly in the mix. It's a great tool in that respect IMO.

Don't have much experience with the non-ai U87s but I refuse to buy into the hype about the older ones being better.

I do think that for certain things a tube pre-amp combines well with the 87ai.

[BenWils]

If nothing else comes from this thread, at least I got a nice compliment from Philip Thank you, Philip. You've made my day.

I guess my posting this was to reveal some of the hype about vintage versus newer gear. While there is a small sound difference with these two mics, you would think they sounded like polar opposites the way some people carry on at certain gear focused forums. I guess I just thought it was interesting to find out they sound pretty close.
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Ben


"To be really good at voiceover, you need to improve your footwork and hip snap."

[Mike Sommer]

You would think they are polar opposites, the way some go on about them. But in reality is the differences can be very small shadings.

Frank is pretty much right on concerning why there are so many microphones today- It's a lot like a painter, he can do a lot with just primary colors, but when you need a bright blue you'll be hard pressed to make it without a Pthalo blue. So the larger your color pallet the better the chance you'll have of finding what you need.

40 years ago or so there were only a handful of mic manufacturers, that made pro studio mics, of course there were dozens of of others who mad cheap mics. It's only technology that is blurring the lines today.

And almost every microphone maker is trying to offer a cheap mic that will sell 70 to 100 thousand units a year vs a high end mic that may only sell 5 to 10 thousand in a good year.
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The Blog:
http://voiceoveraudio.blogspot.com/

Acoustics are counter-intuitive. If one thing is certain about acoustics, it is that if anything seems obvious it is probably wrong.

[georgethetech]

This is definitely Gearslutz territory...
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