VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

[Ed Gambill]

I am very pleased to say that Paul Strikwerda has joined the roster of SaVoa as a Friend of SaVoa. Many of you know of him and read his blog. I know that many here are keen in their awareness of the professionalism that is need in the craft. On reading the following;
http://www.nethervoice.com/nethervoice/2011/12/01/amateur-infestation/ it occurred to me that it is a worth while reading.
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Esse quam videri "To be rather than to seem"
www.SaVoa.org No. 07000 Member AES

[ccpetersen]

Paul hits many problems right on the nose, but he's conflating amateur with untrained. Amateur really is someone who loves the avocation he or she has taken to -- in amateur astronomy, for example, there are amateurs who do not have PhDs, but who are extraordinarily good observers, understand the science behind what they're doing, and have made priceless contributions to the field. I've worked with many of them.

Certainly I wouldn't want an amateur doctor or banker or president. But, I think that perhaps Paul's point would be better made if he used the word "untrained". or Unprofessional. What he described as the shortcomings of many of the VOs who sent in noisy recordings, etc. could very well be anathema to a trained "amateur" who wasn't a SaVOA member, for example. There may be many "amateurs" out there who send in silent, professional "sounding" recordings on time, etc. but who just aren't ready for prime time in other areas. From time to time I've gotten an audition from a "pro" making similar mistakes with plosives, etc. Does that make them amateurs? NO, it makes them sloppy.

The article, to me, had a slight tinge of elitism. I know where he's going with it, and I actually even agree that there are folks who should not be behind the mic until they get more training, etc. Hell, I could be one of them some days. But, setting up the word "amateur" as somehow a nasty thing and then shooting it down is a straw man argument. I'd rather see him make the point more clearly (as he does in the second half of his article) with examples that work to illustrate the problem.

Does this make any sense?

[Lapianoman]

Hello, my name is John...and I'm an amateur. I found Paul's blog very informative & I agree with much of what he says. I also think CC makes several good points, especially about the differences between amateurs and the "Untrained".


Here's my thoughts on Paul's concluding questions:

So, what’s your take on the avalanche of amateurs? For good or bad (and I'll agree it's mostly bad), because of advances in technology, it's happening. I'm not sure if anything can necessarily be done to stem the tide.

Do they cheapen our community, or do they enrich us? Much of what I've heard on P2P sites dilutes the pool of talent. I liken the scenario to internet dating sites...there's no end to the number of people hoping to find that "special someone." The cost to the searcher is having to wade through so many unsuitable options, until you find one that fits. Does this make the dating site "cheaper", or does it just mean there's more selection? I guess it depends on your view.

Are they to blame for the steady decline of rates and standards? Yes and no. On one hand, if the Untrained didn't exist, rates and standards should be a non-issue. Companies who hire the Untrained facilitate the decline.

Are they stealing jobs that should have gone to seasoned pros, or do they pick up the crumbs no one wants to eat? I think it's more crumbs than not. If you know of any company that would rather hire an amateur at a professional rate...give them my number! On a serious note, the used car dealership looking for a $20 commercial voiceover who sounds exactly like Morgan Freeman was never on any professional's radar to begin with.

Should some Pay-to-Plays put up a barrier of entry and be more rigid in their quality control, or will the weakest links just put themselves out of the game? Yes and yes. P2P should exercise more quality control, but they make their money by selling memberships, so it's not likely they're going to send anyone away anytime soon. I also think that the weak links drop off when they realize VO is not the get-rich-quick dream they thought it to be.

[Ed Gambill]

CC I don’t believe that I have the right to characterize the word choice Paul made.

I guess we all need to see things through our own telescope.

I would be more inclined to use a more pejorative term.
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Esse quam videri "To be rather than to seem"
www.SaVoa.org No. 07000 Member AES

[ccpetersen]

Ed, Paul posted something that's discussable, and I think that we all can see what he's trying to say, and that his word choice is discussable.

That being said, the issues are real, but his argument strikes me as a bit elitist when he sets up a straw man in order to make a valid point.

Just sayin'.

And, as a professional writer and editor, I absolutely see the influx of people who think they can write coming in and grabbing jobs they aren't qualified for. And, I often get called in to fix those jobs when the non-pro doesn't deliver.

Same thing with VO. Again, all of us have off days, but what Paul is getting at is not the occasional flub but the people coming in without training, or the right equipment, etc. and grabbing off jobs. That being said, I don't think that they're grabbing the big money jobs. It is, as was just noted, a lot of lower-paying jobs, which beget MORE lower-paying jobs, etc...

[Bill Campbell]

Between his blog and responding to all the comments on his blog, Paul seems to have a lot of time on his hands.

Amateur was probably not the best word to base the the blog around. In most endeavors, an "amateur" is usually not allowed to accept cash for performance.
Most sports - golf is a good example. A Private Pilot is not allowed to carry passengers for hire is another.

While I believe there are some very good talents on the P2P sites, most of them are bad engineer/producers. I hire people all the time, some from the P2P sites, and most of the time the audio is not of high quality. 90% of the time we can fix it, though.

Some talents would be better off having an experienced producer, produce their work.
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www.asapaudio.com

[Bailey]

[Leslie Humble]

Another interesting discussion. Here's my take. By the proliferation of "amateur" talent....that I will define as those with some combination of: High noise floor, weak interpretive skills, cheap equipment, bad room with reflections, undistinguished voice, little acting skills, and low intelligence...
We are losing the respect that was part of the reason we became Voiceoverists.
With loss of respect comes low paying jobs, anyone thinking they can get in the game, way too many ex DJ's seeing this as their career path now that they can't get a broadcast job, those unwilling or unable to make the committment neccessary, and a similiar apathy of advertisers and providers that has killed (correct) the Radio industry.

I exempt anyone that is making a sincere effort to get it right. But do you see the confluence of the streams? When anyone thought they were a Radio DJ it meant nothing anymore. When everyone is empowered to be a Voice artist it means nothing. I am not a member of Savoa but I applaud the effort to bring some order to chaos. Does any old Radio hands remember when you had to have a third class license to be on air passing three elements including the dreaded element 9? I was always mad when that testing ended. And I am upset now that our love is so diluted with pretenders that it makes it hard for many of us to make a good living.

Love the great talent I find on these forums!
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There are rules to the Universe. Learn them and prosper. www.HumbleVoiceover.com

[Scott Pollak]

[Gregory Best]

I passed on 1st try too. I can't find mine either that dates back to 1968. I had to delay taking the test in Chicago because of the riots that shut down the city. The National Guard was patrolling the streets.

I see the problem of lowered quality becoming more acceptable. My wife and most of here pro photographer friends have gotten out of the business. Digital has killed it. Digital print quality doesn't come close to professional film negatives used to directly expose print paper.

"Professional" photo labs now (except one we know of) actually digitize negatives with a scanner and use a high quality inkjet printer or one that uses LEDs to expose the paper. We've looked closely at large (20x30) prints where the pixels show. That is not even close to film quality from a large format camera.

When it is acceptable to have cousin Bill shoot your wedding with his little digital camera or Iphone and make prints at Walmart - that's bad. I have someone I work with that had a friend photograph her wedding. She has a picture on her desk she is proud of that isn't near anything I could do and print on my cheap Epson printer. I am no pro, but I can see the difference.

Digital is part of the quality downhill slide.
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Gregory Best

greg@gregorybest.com

[Frank F]

Now you guys are making me feel old. I took and passed the First Class test at the age of 15 (had to stay in the BIG city at my Sisters apartment overnight, cause I could not drive a car yet).

The real question everyone here seems to be avoiding is: "What makes a VOist a professional"? In other words, what separates the men from the boys and the Lady from the girl?

All of us read the term "amateur" with different emphasis. But what makes YOU, or me, a professional?

Situations which arose over the past few months have put me back in the role of "newbie" as far as equipment goes. (I am surviving with the help of friends like RiceVoice, Diane Maggipinto, Greg Best, and Greg Phelps. Their generosity is most appreciated.) I have felt like a beginner, and thought about all of the sage (read: old guy) advice offered by me in the past to those who were at the starting point in their career. Am I a professional? How do I define myself? What gives me the right to define others? Will anyone here or even someone you know offer me advice on how to get past this hump and go from "newbie" to "VO Professional"? I will be the first to say I need the help.

Define your own qualities before you dismiss those of others.

Although I may not agree with Paul Strikwerda's specific words and am not sold on some of his thoughts, they are pervasive in our industry. He tried to write a few words explaining his feelings from his point of view. What have you done for the industry lately?

I salute your prose and your willingness to stand up and shout about your feeling Paul. Good luck!

Frank F
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Be thankful for the bad things in life. They opened your eyes to the good things you weren't paying attention to before. email: thevoice@usa.com

[Gregory Best]

I was 15 as well Frank. My dad took the day off work to drive me into the city to the FCC office. Of course we had to visit the Big 89 WLS where I met Art Roberts and across the river to WCFL. Some days I feel old too.

Frank, you are not a noob, but a consummate professional. 6 years of CBS Supercross narration is not the realm of the noob.
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Gregory Best

greg@gregorybest.com

[Philip Banks]

Every day I receive emails offering me access to Amateur Housewives, I'm certain these women must be an affront to those who work hard to maintain their Professional Housewife status.

The still images are shot using awful cameras, the videos are cheap, the sound appalling, the Pizza doesn't get eaten and the poor delivery boy leaves exhausted AND unpaid. AND don't get me started on them not having licence to do THAT in the back of a Volvo!!

Do these Amateur Housewives, make breakfast, clean, collect the children from school, arrange flowers in a vase or even take the time to abuse an underprivileged Hispanic staff member for not doing the aforementioned? No. Why order a pizza you're not going to eat or give to a house slave in lieu of wages?

The above is an outrage!

I have communicated with some people in the Housewife Industry and suggested they set up SOPHIA - Society of Professional Housewives In America. Their aim should be to raise standards, reduce cellulite, get members to take acting classes and stop wasting pizzas. Upon approval new members will get a small tattoo on the middle of their torso (front) which reads ACCREDITED. This seal should be clearly visible to Voiceoverists who appear to spend an inordinate amount of time navel gazing.

[Lee Gordon]

[Frank F]

Thank you Greg. Lee, it looks like there are several of us in the same click.

I still ask: How does one define a "Professional Voiceoverist"? What separates anyone from the pack? And what does it mean to be a "per-fesh-ee-nail"?

I forgot to mention --- and then there is Phillip Banks. How does one define PB?

(I am working on this from the angle of posts from another thread. Maybe I can now say I have "made" it! Whatever "it" is.)

Frank F
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Be thankful for the bad things in life. They opened your eyes to the good things you weren't paying attention to before. email: thevoice@usa.com