VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

[captain54]

I'm still not really clear as to what is legal or not in terms of background music and effects for a voiceover demo...

Popular songs or original tunes are obviously not good choices... but what about generic background type that people use for Karaoke? say, Karoake background purchased on iTunes?

I voiceover demo is not technically or directly a commercial item, meaning.. not meant to sell a product..

for example.. here is the iTunes/Apple policy
(i) You shall be authorized to use iTunes Products only for personal, noncommercial use.

a voiceover demo is personal use, but it is considered commerical or non commercial?

it is used to make you money in a sense, so this is where the confusion lies...

any advice?

[Jeffrey Kafer]

It's commercial use because your demo is a commercial for your professional, paid services.

Go with music that is SPECIFICALLY royalty-free for commercial and non-commercial uses.

If in doubt, ask the composer/publisher/website.
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Jeff
http://JeffreyKafer.com
Voice-overload Web comic: http://voice-overload.com

[Philip Banks]

Breach of copyright is not determined by use for commercial gain. If you copied, in whole or part, the work of an artist without consent you are in breach.

[Bruce]

Plus, using a well known tune in your demo is not advised anyway. Potential clients will likely guess you weren't in a real session where someone paid huge money for the rights. There's plenty of inexpensive royalty-free music out there. If you'd like to search our archives for previous discussions on where to find this music, click on Search above and enter the following in the search box:

royalty AND free

The AND tells the search engine to look for both words in a post.

B
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VO-BB Member #31 Enlisted June, 2005

I'm not a Zoo, but over the years I've played one on radio/TV. .

[Eddie Eagle]

I'm guessing you are assembling a demo and don't have a real spot with a well known track.

If the spot is a real one that the client paid the fee and you happen to be on it you should be able to use it for promotional use. Typically your contract would let you and the client use any portion of the production for promotional use. But you need to make sure it's worded in there before using it.

But if are indeed assembling a demo without actually having been on a spot you need rights clearance. You should look into Creative Commons.

[captain54]

I'm working on adding a spot that's not a real spot... or a spot I did..

yes. adding a spot with a real commercial track behind it is kind of silly..

I'm not sure what consitutes a for profit use of someones material... or a copyright infringement even if I'm not directly making money from use of that material..

If you buy a track on Itunes I would think the track itself becomes your property to with as you wish, as long as you are not re-selling it or using it for a commercial venture thus making money off of someone else efforts..

then again, I can see how a voiceover demo might be crossing the line because ultimately you are using it to make money for yourself in a promotional sense.

[ccpetersen]

Capn, assumptions about copyright are best checked at the door.

The copyright belongs to the holder, literally the right to copy the music. It doesn't matter what it's for -- commercial, non-commercial, whatever. You're using someone else's music and copying it for your use.

therefore as others have said, look for music that is cleared for such use, which is called "copyright free" but that's a misnomer. It just means that it's cleared for your use and you don't have to pay per use. Technically what you're doing is "synching" the music with your voice, and that's really synchronization, and that's the right you want.

Getting it off iTunes does NOT mean it's free for you to use. In fact, I think it says on iTunes that you're getting music for your own listening use and that other uses must be purchased/negotiated with the copyright holders.

My DH is a composer/performer and we've had this discussion many times with people who do NOT take the time to educate themselves in the rudiments of copyright and usage.

What Philip said is what goes.

So, as others have suggested, look for copyright cleared music for your demo and you'll be safe.
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Charter Member: Threadjackers Local 420

[jsgilbert]

I was singing "White Wedding" in the shower this morning. I hope Billy Idol doesn't sue me.

I will chime in and say "hear hear" to Mr. Eagles recommendation of Creative Commons.

here is a link to everything you need to know.

http://www.seabreezecomputers.com/tips/freemusic.htm
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j.s. gilbert

js@jsgilbert.com
www.jsgilbert.com

"today is the first day of the rest of the week"

[ccpetersen]

There are a lot of people out there putting music up through Creative Commons -- I third that suggestion!
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Charter Member: Threadjackers Local 420

[ccpetersen]

JS, there's a difference between singing it in the shower (private use, no public broadcast or performance) and using it in your demo (public performance).
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Charter Member: Threadjackers Local 420

[heyguido]

And a gentle reminder that the RIAA and other rights organizations commonly use spiders to comb the net for infringing use....

If your site or your demo are out there where the public can see them......


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Don Brookshire
"Wait.... They wanna PAY me for this?"

[jsgilbert]

But I charge people to come here me sing in the shower. You should see the opening act I have booked for next Wednesday.
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j.s. gilbert

js@jsgilbert.com
www.jsgilbert.com

"today is the first day of the rest of the week"

[bobbinbeamo]

And remember, the rights holders have more $$$ than you and can hire badass attorneys. Although everybody pretty much knows when they hear someone's demo with all high-profile national spots, it's usually not from real commercials. Tread carefully.
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Bobbin Beam
www.bobbinbeam.com
blog.bobbinbeam.com

[jsgilbert]

Bobbin,

I'm a little concerned wen you say that when somebody listens to a demo and hears a lot of high profile national stuff that they think it's fake. I was told recently to just use some of my nationals and higher profile stuff on my demo. It's all 100% real. Some of it is still airing.

Are people listening to this and thinking it's not real and studio done?

To me, when I was casting or hiring talent, I always felt that the important aspect to a demo be that it all sound real and be things that the talent would be considered for. Thus, I often hear decent demos that are ruined by a single forced "fake" promo piece or a bad New York accent or something in a completely different tone or agen range than the talent on the demo might do. Occasionally I used to listen to demos where the talent would be doing a spot that I either produced or was talent on.

What then in your opinion would be a better solution for me?

Thanks!

--js
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j.s. gilbert

js@jsgilbert.com
www.jsgilbert.com

"today is the first day of the rest of the week"

[Tom Test]

I can't add anything to the legal part of this discussion. But I will tell you that when I wanted to use a specific track from a Western Swing band that I loved for use on my commercial VO demo, I did a google search and tracked down the band's manager. I explained what I wanted to use the song for and asked for permission to use a portion of the song on my demo (it's a cute piece of music that features a jaunty fiddle). The manager forwarded my request to the lead singer, who gave approval for me to use it for free!

It probably helped that I am a fan, have "liked" their Facebook page, left glowing reviews on Amazon, etc. My wife and I even used the lead singer/fiddle player's name as our daughter's middle name (though we didn't ask permission for that and pay no royalties!
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Best regards,
Tom Test
"The Voice You Trust"
www.tomtest.com