VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

Foog · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:10 am Post subject: V123 and the jobs that aren't

The fact that they stepped up and helped Lee Kanne out with a non-payment issue in no way reduces the crapularity of their continuing to post "jobs" that, well, aren't. Last month they posted a "job" that was actually some sort of voice talent contest with a (minimal) cash prize. When I wrote customer service to complain, I was told that a contest was effectively the same thing as a paying job that you audition for. (I am so not in agreement with this!)

Now today, I see this in the list of jobs that they are offering:

Mike Harrison · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 6:02 am Post subject:

One reason – perhaps – why they think that a contest is a "job" is because Voice123 *and* Voices.com (at least those two) were the creations NOT of people who had ANY experience in voice-over (or any directly related fields) at all, but MARKETING and IT gurus.

They saw people, many of whom were/are under the impression that VO is a quick way to a six-figure income (all we need is the ability to read and speak, right?), and – like car salespeople and/or ambulance-chasing lawyers – the fangs came out.

What do they care? With annual subscriptions of roughly $300, multiplied by the thousands of subscribers, they're sitting rather pretty, I think, as they watch their subscribers spend so much of their time auditioning.

Reading some of the blog posts and/or podcasts produced by these self-appointed VO "experts" cause me to throw up a little in my mouth: it's either widely generalized fluff, or off the mark entirely (read: shite).

While I understand that some people have had some/good success with them, as far as I'm concerned: P2P? FEH.
_________________
Mike
Male Voice Over Talent
I have taken leave of my sensors.

heyguido · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 9:25 am Post subject:

Right out of the park, Mike.
_________________
Don Brookshire
"Wait.... They wanna PAY me for this?"

Eddie Eagle · M&M Joined: 23 Apr 2008 Posts: 2393

FEH, the new MEH

bobbinbeamo · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 10:24 am Post subject:

DONE! BOOM!
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Bobbin Beam
www.bobbinbeam.com
blog.bobbinbeam.com

Lee Gordon · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:32 am Post subject:

I would like to remind you that there is nothing in the terms of service for these, or any P2Ps I know of, that requires subscribers to audition for all the crappy jobs they post.

Many people have suggested that the P2Ps are killing the VO industry because they offer crappy jobs like these. But I believe what is more likely to kill the industry isn't that they offer these jobs; it's that people take them.
_________________
Lee Gordon, O.A.V.
Voice President of the United States
www.leegordonproductions.com
Twitter: @LeeGordonVoice

Bish · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:43 am Post subject:

Lee is ultimately right.

I actually think "we" are to blame in other ways as well. There are many good VOs out there that publish blogs, work with demo mills, provide coaching etc... all designed to sell the dream to hopeful noobs with open wallets. Free money is difficult to ignore sometimes... but a lot of "experienced and righteous pillars of our community" are taking those doubtful dollars with nary a thought about how they are supporting the myth that "everyone can do this".... which then floods the market at the bottom-end.

I shall now don my tin hat and get ready to dig myself out. I mean from the snow of course... the snow Wink

_________________
Bish a.k.a. Bish
Smoke me a kipper... I'll be back for breakfast.
I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls.

heyguido · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 11:47 am Post subject:

You're forgiven.

All we ask is a pic of you in the aforementioned tin hat. Wink

_________________
Don Brookshire
"Wait.... They wanna PAY me for this?"

Mike Harrison · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:09 pm Post subject:

What Lee and Bish said (thank you, Don!)

I even shy away from participating in many LinkedIn group discussions because so much of what's posted quite often comes from folks who are rather new who speculate, and it just makes the head spin (where DO they come up with this stuff?).

The only piece of advice I have for newcomers at the outset: you don't need studio-quality recording gear right away. What you need – first and foremost – is to learn the craft of voice-over. Once you do that... IF you do that... the other stuff comes later.

My personal proverb: Owning a stove does NOT make one a chef.
_________________
Mike
Male Voice Over Talent
I have taken leave of my sensors.

Foog · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:14 pm Post subject:

I'm not satisfied with just saying "oh well, I signed up for it and it is what it is." I'd much rather engage in pointless hand-wringing. ...no, wait. That didn't come out right!

I think what I meant to say is that even though I made an informed choice to re-subscribe with the major P2P sites this year knowing full well what the business model is and what kind of behaviour (both market and personal) it encourages, there is a broad range that exists within that model and often room for improvement. V123 actually intervening to ensure someone got paid is an example to the good. Posting so-called jobs with terms that should be downright offensive to even the most starry-eyed newcomer... not so much.
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Andrew Fogarasi

captain54 · Lucky 700 Joined: 30 Jan 2006 Posts: 744 Location: chicago

I agree wholeheartedly that just because a "job" is posted, doesn't mean it needs to be responded to. There's lot of red flags in an audition posting that you simply have to learn to run from. I usually make back my $400 annual fee many times fold, pick up repeat clients, with less than 10 hrs weekly spent in auditioning..Keeping in mind that by sending auditions out, I'm shooting my product out there to potential talent buyers. That's not a bad deal for picking up some supplemental income

I think everyone should read Bish's post.. at least once. maybe twice. There's a lot of P2P bashing in the community, but what gets swept under the rug is the grape picking among the more established members thru coaching, demos, workshops, etc.. toward those hungry for the dream of hitting it big in VO.. I'm not saying that legitimate services are not offered, but I wonder how much of a reality dose is given along with all that coaching, etc.. as to how hard it is, almost impossible it is to make it in this grind, and how much real down and dirty effort it really takes.
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Lee Kanne
www.leekanne.com

bobsouer · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:23 pm Post subject:

Bish · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:44 pm Post subject:

There are many blogs out there (Bob's included) that make for good reading. I have my own short-list and savor the insights and commentary from people with something to say... usually people with far more experience than me... or people who are just plain entertaining.

I think we must make our own rules and look at our motivations. I understand that I was making a very sweeping statement and should make it clear that I totally support coaches and service providers who target the industry in a responsible manner... it's just the whole "selling the dream" thing that I have a problem with.
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Bish a.k.a. Bish
Smoke me a kipper... I'll be back for breakfast.
I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls.

Lee Gordon · Posted: Mon Jan 26, 2015 5:27 pm Post subject:

Mike Harrison · Posted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 6:22 am Post subject:

You're on to something there, Lee. I think it's only a matter of time before something like that appears on fiverr.com. If it hasn't already.
_________________
Mike
Male Voice Over Talent
I have taken leave of my sensors.