VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

[yarg28]

first, know that I suffer from analysis paralysis a great deal. I'm a bit of a researcher and perfectionist. I'm searching for the voice of reason.

I'm extremely handy. I modified the Dawbox design and built it myself and it's just what I wanted for under a grand all in. 4'x6', Larger door size, 3/4" mdf, single wall. It's 100% completed...minus the acoustic treatment. I mean it's ready to treat and start making money.

Here is the problem, I cant decide for the life of me what to do about acoustic treatment. My original idea was to build panels (about 19 of them) out of 3.5" recycled denim and cover them with fabric. Pretty much cover the entire booth. That sent me on the search for acoustically transparent fabric that isn't a million dollars a yard or cheap and ugly. Unicorn.

Then the common sense part of me kicked in and i thought maybe just go with auralex or something similar. Obviously people use that material in booths. I mean whisperroom includes it in their packages. But then you go read forums and everybody is like, "OMG NO FOAM EVER, ITS THE DEVIL!".

And Auralex is actually pretty expensive also. It would maybe save me $150 to go with all auralex instead of building. I could have it by Thursday and up by Friday morning though. No work to finish up. Boom, done.

Then I looked at alternatives to Auralex and about the only other semi legit foam supplier was ATS acoustics. They are much cheaper but not exactly what i'd call cheap. But then I wonder, "am i getting a lot less for the money? will being cheap ruin my booth?! is their foam inferior!!?"

I'm dying. I have this awesome booth just waiting and I cant process all of this. Does anybody have any practical experience that can help with this? I really dont want to spend extra money and time to "over do" it but I'd rather do that than "under do" it.

Sigh.
I'm sure this seems like a ludicrous, first world problem, but I need this to be correct.

thanks for any help.

gary

[Rob Ellis]

I feel your pain on the acoustic treatment thing. Glad that is over for me.

I ordered all of my material and some fully assembled panels from ATS. No shortcuts on quality IMO. You can order with confidence.

[juliaknippen]

Book George Whittam for a sound consult and buy whatever he tells you to buy from ATS. Done.
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[vkuehn]

Coming up with an answer to your acoustics is a lot like reaching out into the world and trying to select a religion. It can be a bit "mystical".

George Whittam may not be the world's best acoustical consultant, but as I will explain in a moment, for your purposes he may actually be the best after all.

Acoustical trends have changed every decade or two for the last 80 years or so. Classical music halls seating maybe thousands of people were early challenges.

Then came the golden age of radio from the mid 30s to the early 50s and people learned to make those big rooms that were often 20 feet by 30 feet and maybe 24 feet tall.

Then we went from a few national major recording studios in the 40s for the record industry to the point every fourth teenager in America apparently has a garage or basement space for creating music recordings.

Now we have the age of Mega-churches and their army of specialized acoustical people.

When you ask for advice, as you did here, make sure you understand what the target projects are for the person giving the advice. When you read consultants books about all the kinds of projects I listed above, you will find each decade and each industry discovers methods that are unique, different for the venue.

ENTER GEORGE WHITTAM (and some others who do what he does.)

These folks can tell you of success and failures when dealing with these small, small, sometime much too small spaces we call BOOTHS. They constantly do small booths, over and over and over.

And even with expert advice, be prepared to have to rip out some little part of your new treatment and implement a "re-do".

My friends who do the acoustics for mega-churches have never been able to get excited about telling me how to do a 4 x 6 booth. Besides that, their consulting fee would exceed my expected total cost of construting the booth several times over.

And for every material and every technique that does into the project, never get confused over which ones help the sound PROOFING and which ones help the ACOUSTICS.

Have fun.

[NorthEndVoice]

The recycled denim (BAC...or Bonded Acoustical Cotton) is preferable for acoustic panels in a small space, in my opinion. These are easier to make than you might think. When I was treating my similar sized studio space, I looked at EVERYTHING and the BAC came out on top in every area. Easy to work with...no "off gassing" fumes...no fiberglass strands everywhere...etc.

With a little bit of prep, you can easily make whatever size panels you want that are indistinguishable from "store bought" panels. You don't need a whole lot of money or the skills of a custom builder to make these. I'm no craftsman by any means and I did seven 24" x 48" panels over the course of two afternoons.These are basic absorption panels that look just like what you see in studios everywhere.

If you'd like, I can provide pics of the ones I made along with a material list and easy to follow instructions. Once you get one made...the rest are easy. Matter of fact, two weekends ago, I had some leftover material and some extra time so I made an acoustic "cloud" for the ceiling. Same process.

Consulting with George W would probably prove to be beneficial as well. Absorption and proper bass trapping are definitely called for in these smaller studio spaces.

Happy to help if you like.

[todd ellis]

i'm in a different situation - 10'x12' room -- but i have been SUPER happy with the recycled denim insulation panels i built. some 1"x3" boards & 1/4" luan backing. to you point - i did the "can-i-breath-through-it" test with the cheapest cotton sheets wal-mart had and (after i came to from the hyperventilating) realized that they passed --- so that's what i used. a twin sheet covered two 2'x7' panels. hung on a french cleat - i can add/remove/move at will.
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[yarg28]

thanks for all the input.

To clarify, my main struggle was whether or not to use auralex type foam or build my own panels. I definitely wont buy panels since they have to be custom for my booth to maximize space and coverage.

And Todd, I pretty much got on the denim train because I saw you posting about it a while back. I checked the acoustic specs for it and it is (to your initial recommendation) really nice and cheap. I just couldnt find a better value not to mention that the concerns over off gassing are removed from the equation.

My biggest issue is that I really wanted fabric that looked "nice". Not cheap or cheesy looking. I may have found a solution last night. GIK will sell their stock fabric by the yard for about $10/yard which isnt exactly cheap but its much cheaper that the GOM fabric and I've seen GIK's fabric in person and its very nice looking. I also know it meets all the specs that I need if it meets their specs.

I was so in love with the idea of just buying Auralex and getting it over with but I found some strength last night. I've decided that I'm not going to get lazy on the last piece of the puzzle.

Thanks again for the input. It helped!

Also, the idea of using cheap cotton sheets is nice! I'll check into that as well.

gary

[ricevoice]

[Brian in Charlotte]

I've spent more time than I can count on research regarding acoustic panels. While building them is certainly an option (and I did for my listening/edit room as well as bass traps in the booth)), what we all want is the end result of a good sounding room. The physics of the space are the physics of the space. Someone like George Whittam is a good resource, obviously.

I chose GIK Acoustics after consulting with them about my space. They took the size of the booth and was able to guide me as to which panels would tame the troubles I was having and recommended the panels and placement.

Whichever way you decide, just be sure you've reviewed and understood the absorption ability of the material you use...nothing more key than that. Places like ATS & GIK have done the homework and have the testing numbers for you to look at and make your best decision. The fit/finish of purchased panels is sure hard to beat, if aesthetics with performance are important to you.
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[Lee Gordon]

I don't remember which DIY TV show I stole this idea from, but it has worked for me. Assuming the look is compatible with what you're going for, skip the fabric store and go to the paint department of your home improvement store and buy canvas drop cloths. It will be way cheaper than the same quantity of similar material from Jo-Ann or whomever. Obviously, the material is designed to not be penetrated by liquids, so the weave is too tight to be used for something like speaker grille cloth, but to wrap around insulation to make acoustic panels, it is probably just fine. And I imagine you can also find burlap for sale at the same lumber yard, also cheaper than in a fabric store.

In my own booth, I made a quilt from Roxul Safe 'n Sound insulation, sandwiched between two furniture blankets. It works fine, but the aesthetics may not be for everyone.
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[vkuehn]

This borders on getting off-topic, but:

I had never followed up fully on the "shredded denim" that has come up in conversations since I bought enough Roxul to do my digs. But this thread needled my curiosity and so I followed up the B A C terminology and learned more about shredded denim than I could imagine.

But here is what I stumbled into and I regret that I didn't capture the URL at the time: I gather that the guy who brings us (and maybe invented?) Green Glue has some web-site material on noise reduction for the ventilation of home theater installs. Voice Over people may be content to endure some stuffy air when sitting alone in a booth, but if you have convinced your spouse that you need a really spiffy home theater at a cost of several thousand dollars, and you may have 6, 8 or 10 people sitting in this "studio".... stuffy stale air can quickly become a big annoyance. The web site that caught my attention referred to "dead mufflers" and there were several pictures of creating "Rat's Maze" type contraptions lined with BAC in order to get ventilation air in and out of a home theater while keep the loudness of the move inside the theater, and keeping the external noise away from the guests who are there luxuriate in your movie palace.

Next time you get this wild-hair idea that you must do some ventilation, look up some of these terms. There probably a lot more that I didn't take the time to search and read. (I am in a NON-CONSTRUCTION phase of life for a few months! I didn't search because I didn't want to be tempted. )

[Bruce]

I bought some professionally made sound panels (ACS) and they're covered in burlap... very nice burlap. I've seen very affordable regular burlap at discount fabric/upholstery stores over the years. It's definitely got the holes you need.


B
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I'm not a Zoo, but over the years I've played one on radio/TV. .

[Lee Gordon]

[vkuehn]

I would be interested in knowing what fan you selected. It is hard to get meaningful data on fans. (Things like noise generated and cubic-feet-per-minute of air flow.)

Years ago I collected some numbers about air velocity and I started to post them in one of our discussions recently but I decided I wanted better documentation, and maybe some fresh experience.

I am also thinking about investing in one of those little u-shaped tubes with a water leel that the HVAC people sometimes use to air flow. Apparently the simple ones are not all that expensive.

My memory is that air flow should be somewhere below 200 feet per minute. (That translates to 2.25 Miles Per Hour.)

HVAC people apparently install a lot of stuff pushing air 900, 1200 maybe 1500 feet per minute which is N-O-I-S-Y!!! (14 to 18 miles per hour.)

[georgethetech]

Thanks for the plugs, gang!
I'm booked thru end of January.
Just dropped in between sessions to see what's new!

NAB seems to think I know enough to speak on small booth acoustics this April, .gif" alt="W00T" border="0" />

G
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