VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

JTVG · Backstage Pass Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 433

I noticed that the basic version of Source Connect ($395) will only handle mono rates up to 96k and stereo rates up to 192k. Could any of you Source Connecters tell me if it will receive rates any higher than that from someone sending audio using the Pro version?

Thanks!
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Joe Szymanski
http://www.joethevoiceguy.com

Frank F · Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2007 4:09 pm Post subject:

The answer is YES! However, to make this possible you would need a very fast broadband connection. The minimums at the higher rates would be near 3 mbps/sustained up and down - on both sides of the connection.

F2
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JTVG · Backstage Pass Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 433

Thanks Frank.

My download speed tests at 5441 kbps and my upload speed tests at 490 kbps. If I wanted to send mono 128k Source Connect audio to another user, would that upload speed inhibit me?
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Joe Szymanski
http://www.joethevoiceguy.com

Frank F · Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2007 7:03 pm Post subject:

Mono, 128 k you would be fine. Is this a requirement of one of your clients?

Mono, 96 kbps from a 16 bit 44.1 kHz source is considered "near CD quality" (or as some would say "broadcast quality") as .mp3, 128 kbps is "studio quality" from 16 bit, 48 kHz.

SC would require 512 minimum for stereo at 128 or above.

Remember, BOTH sides of the connection would require the similar upload and download speeds.

Toodles

F2
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JTVG · Backstage Pass Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 433

Good to know.

Actually, I'll likely be using a setup that allows for a homeade bridge to ISDN. Therefore, I need to offer quality that compares to the L2 Mono 128 setting on a Zephyr. I don't think 96kbps cuts it.

Thanks again.
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Joe Szymanski
http://www.joethevoiceguy.com

bobsouer · Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2007 7:45 pm Post subject:

Joe,

I can tell you from experience with paying clients that the audio quality using the standard Source Connect version bridged to ISDN has worked extremely well. I'm not the only one on this board who has had similar experiences, again with paying clients.
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Bob Souer (just think of lemons)
The second nicest guy in voiceover.
+1-724-613-2749
Source Connect, phone patch, pony express

Frank F · Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2007 8:15 pm Post subject:

Thanks Bob, that was my comment exactly.

Good luck with your project Joe.

Toodles

Frank F
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Be thankful for the bad things in life. They opened your eyes to the good things you weren't paying attention to before. email: thevoice@usa.com

JTVG · Backstage Pass Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 433

That's Bob and Frank. That'd be real cash-saver if the 96kbps is good quality.

Although, Source Connect still suggests having your remote studio PC or laptop running their Pro version for less delay when using the ISDN arrangement. The Source Connect that couples to the ISDN box could be the basic though.
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Joe Szymanski
http://www.joethevoiceguy.com

bobsouer · Posted: Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:07 am Post subject:

Joe,

There's no question the Pro version of Source Connect gives you much more "fine tuning" control over the various parameters; but the Standard version works very, very well. Though, you're right, when bridged to ISDN, there is somewhat more delay.
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Be well,
Bob Souer (just think of lemons)
The second nicest guy in voiceover.
+1-724-613-2749
Source Connect, phone patch, pony express

JTVG · Backstage Pass Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 433

Well 96k it will be then, as I just got an email back from Robert at Source Connect who says a Pro version coupled to a basic version will still be limited to 96kbps. I'm guessing the Pro may send it out higher but the basic will only recieve it at 96.

Buying two Pro versions is out of the question so 96kbps it'll have to be if we go this route.

I've always seemed to notice a slight bit of artifacting on any VO below 128 mono.

By the way, in case anyone is curious. This isn't a pleasure project just so I can do ISDN on the road (though it will allow me to do that). ISDN only goes about 18,000 feet. Anywhere between 16 and 18,000 is sketchy and I found out yesterday I'm 17,870 feet from the telco office. This would account for my occasional dropouts.

So, IF AT&T won't budge and put a repeater in the line like I want them to, our next option is to hook the Zephyr up at the inlaws a couple of towns over, They ARE close to the telco office. so we shouldn't have line issues. Source Connect would help me access it whenever I need do a session. It's a little more hands off than I'd like, but we may be left with no other choice. I'd rather not pay to bridge each time I do a session, especially since I already have the Zephyr.
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Joe Szymanski
http://www.joethevoiceguy.com

JTVG · Backstage Pass Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 433

I just did a quick test of the 96kbps setting through an ISDN box.

I saved a simple 10 second piece of voice at 96k mono and piped it through the ISDN box (running L2 Mono 128 setting) and you're right, it still sounds good. As long as it pipes through Source Connect that clean, it would work fine once it hits the ISDN line.
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Joe Szymanski
http://www.joethevoiceguy.com

Frank F · Posted: Sat Aug 11, 2007 10:09 am Post subject:

Joe.

As long as you are starting with 48k audio, piping the audio into SC, then receiving the "bridged" version at the 96k rate, and dumping that audio into the ISDN codec (Telos) - then sending that audio to your client, and reversing the audio to get back to you - there is going to be delay... and a lot of delay. You will have good "broadcast quality audio" - just with high latency.

I would expect you have between 800 and 1500 ms delay or "latency" on a bridged set-up through SC/Telos. This combination could cause even more delay due to the path your audio must take to work with your client.

You have some major decisions to make regarding the "repeater" as well. This technology is very old and may introduce additional artifacts and latency. Instead of taking the hard path. If I may suggest an alternative plan - find a small office or friends basement or "closet" which is closer to the Telco which you consider using as an adjunct "studio" for any ISDN codec required sessions. This suggestion would preclude you having to set up a bridge and would be close to home and easier to work with than your previous suggested idea.

Toodles

F2
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JTVG · Backstage Pass Joined: 21 Jun 2007 Posts: 433

Frank,

I appreciate that advice. To me, renting office space seems more expensive and time consuming than a bridge. As we just moved to the area recently, there's not really anyone in the immediate vicinity that I'd feel comfortable intruding upon. Plus, bedroom or office, the room would have to be treated for good sound. Your option might be more feasable if our situation was just a little different. I'll keep it in mind anyway though as we may have no other choice.

Hey Bob - You've done Digifon bridge sessions with ISDN and Source Connect I believe. Was the delay tough to deal with?
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Joe Szymanski
http://www.joethevoiceguy.com

bobsouer · Posted: Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:18 pm Post subject:

Joe,

It's is as Frank noted above, quite noticeable, but nothing that prevents communication. Liz had a session the other day bridging through EDNet and noticed the same thing, but as long as you remember to pause for a moment before you say something, it's not that tough.
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Be well,
Bob Souer (just think of lemons)
The second nicest guy in voiceover.
+1-724-613-2749
Source Connect, phone patch, pony express

Lizden · Posted: Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:31 pm Post subject:

Hey Joe!
As Bob said, I had a SC/ISDN Bride session last week.
If you remember to wait a beat or two before answering any question or making a comment after the other end says something you'll be fine!

It's really not that big a deal after the first couple of minutes!

L.
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Liz de Nesnera O.A.V. ~ Livin' The VO Dream!
English/French Bilingual VO w/ ISDN
HireLiz.com / liz@hireliz.com