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Wal-Mart greeter job...here I come!!
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SheSpeaksCopy
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2005 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh my, it's a shame that this is still going on after 20+ years of being away from the studio. I made better money then that and was clueless as to how good I had it then!

As an aside: The "something for nothing" mentality is rampant in the writing world as well. I can't begin to count the number of times that I've been contacted by individuals and businesses who want me to write full SEO content for a website for 50 dollars a page! They have no real concept of the time, energy, creativity and marketing background I've invested in honing my writing skills.

You have no idea how relieved I am to see all of you offended by this kind of "street corner business" behavior.

It's official: I am definitely in the right forum of VO professionals! Laugh
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Bruce
Boardmeister


Joined: 06 Jun 2005
Posts: 7240
Location: Portland, OR

PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Get your free tacos! Just read us a spot!

Will announce for food!

My God. This appeared in our local Craig's list:

"Production Director for nationwide news/sports radio network seeks voice talent to add to voice bank.

Men and/or women. Bi-lingual (English/Spanish) also needed.

My studio is located in XXX, but I am really looking for candidates with experience, that have access to a studio.

Compensation:
:60 = $50.
:30 = $25.
:10 = $10 or a gift coupon of some kind. (Movie pass, food coupons, etc.)

Please email me (at address below) a sample of your voice in mp3 format only. No more than two cuts, either :10 or :30. "


And this outfit does big professional and athletic team broadcasts that are beamed statewide in many different states!

Bruce
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steeleman
Contributor


Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 39
Location: Birmingham, Al.

PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 8:39 pm    Post subject: voice 123456789 Reply with quote

I gotta chime in... I signed up a year ago for this site. I have really
made about 1400.00 thru the site BUT not directly. I found clients
who returned to me for projects.. I saw this cheap !@#$ lead and
thought... who is this TV station? They will get what they pay for!
As others..in a week when my membership runs out...I'm gone!

Now would you like MILD, HOT or FIRE sauce with your Taco?
OR...Good afternoon welcome to Wal Mart...my that's a cute
little kid there...would you like a smiley face sticker????? :P :P
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 10480

PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On a heavier note, I believe that professional voice overs are part of the solution. Put, Dr Philip Banks on my business card that means something. If I put, Philip Banks Voice Over Talent, it is meaningless in terms of qualifications, expertise, experience or any other quality bench mark a client could reasonably expect.

"Some company on 456voice dared to post a job offering $30 for an international buy-out". He trawled the internet, he listened and thought that if that is a representative cross section of the so-called talent out there it would be unreasonable for him to be expected to pay a good rate.

We, boys and girls are unable to clean up the clients act but we are able to clean up our own. Learn from the good defence lawyers. Find every scrap of evidence available that proves the case against the voice over (you). Set out to get yourself convicted of being a major voice over fraud. Obviously I hope that none of the evidence stands up to being tested.

Here is the charge sheet in the case Clients Versus Philip Banks.
Fraudulent misrepresentation in claiming to be a voice over professional in good standing and justified in his expectations of being renumerated as such.

Substitute my name for yours; how's the prosecution case looking?

"But your honour, I got me a $50 job from W-IBBLE FM"

"You were lucky and luck is not admissable evidence"
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Deirdre
Czarina Emeritus


Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 12933
Location: East Jesus, Maine

PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 5:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the method of upping the ante used by non-union folks-- Using the Union pay scale as your rate card.

Believe me--if a client wants a great voice for their project, they'll pay for it.
Working for smaller clients is a wonderful way to establish your reputation and clientelle, but in bigger markets where the budgets for advertising can be HUGE, there is money that can be earmarked for the voice talent. They won't unless you ask.


Deliver a consistently excellent product.
Be a "good guy".
Charge what you're worth.
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SheSpeaksCopy
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

" Happily working for pennies tells the world your best efforts are only worth small change."
Anita Franklin
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brianforrester
Backstage Pass


Joined: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 492
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada

PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like where this thread has gone!!

Anita, I love the quote... is it yours and if it is, can I use it in some of the presentations that I do?

Phil, you've taken the board to another level in the past week, by making us all think critically about what it is we have simply been b!&#ing about. It's important to be able to vent, but once we've gotten it off of our chest, it does us no good if we don't analyze why it bothered us in the first place, and what we can do to avoid the situation in the future...

It is imposible to find a solution to a problem using the same mindset that created it in the first place.

Okay, who took the old Phil and where did you put him?! It must have been the cuddly teddy bear in your avatar.

Ladies and gentlemen, this continues to be a fun, enjoyable and most importantly educational board. Thank you to all of you for your continued input and annecdotes!

All the best for an enjoyable weekend
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Brian Forrester Voice Overs
www.brianforrester.com
brian@brianforrester.com
778.668.5715
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ConnieTerwilliger
Triple G


Joined: 07 Dec 2004
Posts: 3298
Location: San Diego - serving the world

PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 11:13 am    Post subject: Quotes Reply with quote

My first business card (somewhere in the very early 80's when I was still wearing lots of production hats - writer, producer, on- and off-camera talent) is still on the wall of one of my business associates...it contained a "revised" Samuel Johnson quote...

"Only amateurs write for free."

My mother was shocked at the sentiment - thought that it was flippant.
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SheSpeaksCopy
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

brianforrester wrote:
I like where this thread has gone!!

Anita, I love the quote... is it yours and if it is, can I use it in some of the presentations that I do?


Hi Brian, yes the quote is mine. Hot off the PowerHouse Copy Press! I will need to see how and where you intend to use it before I give permission for it to be used in print. It's that copywrite thing we all deal with! :wink:

My version is a different twist on a saying my Dad used while we were growing up. "People will pay you only as much as they percieve you to have value. "

Getting back to the thread:

People in general will pay more for what they percieve to be a good value for the money...every time. We all do it. When you change your percieved value of an object or service then the process starts all over again. This is why being second choice should never be considered "1st loser" status. Client's can and often do change their mind. Pricing yourself appropriately and doing your best will always reflect back on you in a positive light. Believe me I learned this the hard way. I freelance also, and my stable of clients is much better now that I implimented that one "small change."
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 10480

PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2005 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We moan, we criticise but we never move on. Are these the 10 steps to Voice over greatness?

1 - Worry as much about Don La Fontaine as he does about you.
2 - Don't like what the client is offering? Memorise the following
phrase "No thank you".
3 - They critiqued your demo and you lost how much work? Usually
nothing. How much is a worthless opinion worth to you?
4 - Find out if your voice coach likes your voice or your $100 per
session.
5 - Learn from the voice overs you respect but don't try to be the
voice overs you respect that's their job.
6 - It's your demo make sure the producer puts all of you in it and
none of him.
7 - In a session when the phrase "that read sucks" is uttered
make sure it was by you.
8 - Your voice will get you your first job but your people skills may
prevent you from getting your second.
9 - Don't make false claims, you will get found out.
10 - Count your blessings every day and ensure you pass a few on
to others.
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Drew
King's Row


Joined: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 1118
Location: Tumbleweed Junction, The Republic of North Texas

PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2005 4:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sound and fitting advice, Phil.
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Skype: andrew.hadwal1
Although I have a full head of hair, I'm quite ribald.
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SheSpeaksCopy
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2005 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Empowering words, Phil. Thanks!
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brianforrester
Backstage Pass


Joined: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 492
Location: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2005 10:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah! I like it!!

Thanks Phil...
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Brian Forrester Voice Overs
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brian@brianforrester.com
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Gregory Best
The Gates of Troy


Joined: 04 Aug 2005
Posts: 1845
Location: San Diego area (east of Connie and south and east of Bailey)

PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2005 10:08 pm    Post subject: Words to live by Reply with quote

I like it Phil. If you don't mind, I will print them out and post them near my computer to remind me daily of what is important.
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Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 10480

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 12:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm pleased to learn that the contents of my list has hit the spot, certainly gave me cause to think. Thanks for the positive comments and needless to say anyone may print,copy or pass it on.
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