VO-BB - 19 YEARS OLD! Forum Index VO-BB - 19 YEARS OLD!
Where A.I. is a four-letter word.
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

VO coach won't name a couple customers
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    VO-BB - 19 YEARS OLD! Forum Index -> Chat
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Moosevoice
Club 300


Joined: 16 Nov 2012
Posts: 384
Location: Iowa

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 4:52 am    Post subject: VO coach won't name a couple customers Reply with quote

Is it weird that a VO coach, when asked so I can reference, WON'T disclose any of the VO actors he's worked with?
I asked him just so I can peruse and get a sample of his coaching work.
He says that most of his clients don't want to be seen as 'needing help,' or something along those lines.
Am I wrong in wanting to know who has hired him and how their experience with him as a coach was?
_________________
www.moosevoice.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 11046
Location: Portgordon, Scotland

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, you are not wrong! That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever read. Whilst I am not a Coach even I could send you to people who could not only tell you what I did but also add numbers too. Numbers =MONEY.

Someone shouting AWESOME at me does not feed Bess the Border Collie.

On social media I once asked Rudi Gaskin for an example of how something he was teaching worked. My reason was that I knew he was onto something and didn't want others to miss his valuable point. My polite enquiry prompted him to block me. Well done him.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Mike Harrison
M&M


Joined: 03 Nov 2007
Posts: 2029
Location: Equidistant from New York City and Philadelphia, along the NJ Shore

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think you're wrong.

From what I've seen, voice actors seem to be proud of having been coached, placing on their websites the names of the various coaches they've worked with. In a sense, it's like the listing of one's education on a resume.

Similarly, I would think a coach would want to show that he or she has something of a track record.

That this coach will not suggests to me there may not be a track record or one worthy of sharing. But, maybe I am missing some nuance.
_________________
Mike
Male Voice Over Talent
I have taken leave of my sensors.

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 11046
Location: Portgordon, Scotland

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the context of what we do and the body of work on our websites I see no value in mentioning coaches to the people most likely to hire us. Needless to say there will be exceptions but I am unable to think of any. Should anyone have the intuitive skill they'll get hired and the rest is worked out during the session.

What prompts people to invest, or in most cases, over invest (see also waste) in coaching? First there is the fear element and second there is the perceived credibility of the coach somehow giving our careers a blessing.

The best reason for working with a VO coach is (a) You want to and (b) if there is no return on the investment it's fine, you can take the hit.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Bish
3.5 kHz


Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Posts: 3738
Location: Lost in the cultural wasteland of Long Island

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 6:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry guys... I'm going to disagree.

The coach/client relationship should be as private as either party wants it to be. It's a professional arrangement and should be confidential if required. If (as has become the norm) the VO wants to spew it all over social media and give the coach some publicity... that's fine. But it's not for the coach to do without express permission... I think that would be grossly unprofessional.

I know I'm stretching a point (but, that's what I do) but how would we think if all "professionals" made their client lists public... we love it when it's a High Class Madam... but what if it's your psychiatrist? If I patronize your business, I am not implicitly giving you permission to use my name for your own publicity or marketing.

With the amount of social media spewing and entitlement that's become the norm, we have come to expect these things... people asking openly for another VO's client list... and then getting huffy when they're given a WTF reply. Most coaches and demo producers seem to have added the "right to promote" to their agreements and you get obnoxiously narcissistic "coach & student" screen-shots littering social media.

So no... if the coach does not have explicit permission to do so, or maintains it as a standard policy, I have absolutely no issues with them keeping their client list private.
_________________
Bish a.k.a. Bish
Smoke me a kipper... I'll be back for breakfast.
I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
todd ellis
A Zillion


Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 10479
Location: little egypt

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 6:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

them: i am a great voiceover coach!
me: prove it.

i have a new doctor because someone i trusted recommended him to me. i have a mechanic because someone i trusted recommended him to me. i have a (insert profession here) because someone i trusted recommended him to me.

Quote:
it's not for the coach to do without express permission.

agreed. if the coach is a good business person, they will have a referral network in place.

i say this all the time, "are you happy with how this project turned out? if so, can i have a couple of sentences to share with potential clients? or ... if so, EVERY NOW AND THEN, can i send someone to you so you can share your experience?"

usually the answer is "you bet!"

also - i don't "social media" - but this -
Quote:
people asking openly for another VO's client list... and then getting huffy when they're given a WTF reply.

is the most ridiculous thing i've heard today!*



*it's early, though.
_________________
"i know philip banks": todd ellis
who's/on/1st?

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 11046
Location: Portgordon, Scotland

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bish wrote:
Sorry guys... I'm going to disagree.

The coach/client relationship should be as private as either party wants it to be.


Thanks for picking up on that point. I should've been clearer.

I certainly would not expect anyone to disclose anything without prior consent and firmly believe confidentiality should be the default.

Ooooooo the tales I COULD tell, but don't!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Moosevoice
Club 300


Joined: 16 Nov 2012
Posts: 384
Location: Iowa

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For the record, I wasn't 'WTFing.' I just thought it a little strange.
I can respect the privacy aspect of it all but let's be honest here. They're not doctors. There's no sacred oath going on. There's no Hippocratic Oath.
You're helping people talk better while selling shoes in 15 seconds!
I wouldn't hire a landscaper without seeing their previous work. And, yes, you can 'Apples and Oranges' this but the bottom line is if I'm seeking out coaching/advice/tutelage on something related to my CAREER and I can't afford Phillip Banks' exorbitant rates Wink I don't think it unreasonable to have at least a couple former customers (because 'client' makes me thing of VO clients) to check out.
Maybe this is something the coach could ask of a couple customers?
My feeling is this particular coach is not reliant on this income for their main revenue so it's not something at the top of their priority list versus their VO career. Maybe a 'take it or leave it' approach?
_________________
www.moosevoice.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Lee Gordon
A Zillion


Joined: 25 Jul 2008
Posts: 6843
Location: West Hartford, CT

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bish wrote:
if the coach does not have explicit permission to do so, or maintains it as a standard policy, I have absolutely no issues with them keeping their client list private.


I agree about the permission, but I think it is incumbent on the coach to obtain permission from at least three of his or her students to use them as references.

If I'm hiring someone to paint my bathroom, I want to hear from a few of the painter's past customers to know how satisfied they were. My career ought to be at least as important as how I like my loo.
_________________
Lee Gordon, O.A.V.
Voice President of the United States
www.leegordonproductions.com
Twitter: @LeeGordonVoice
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Bish
3.5 kHz


Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Posts: 3738
Location: Lost in the cultural wasteland of Long Island

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Philip Banks wrote:
Thanks for picking up on that point. I should've been clearer.

This is where time differences matter. Philip's early afternoon is probably a calm oasis filled with a mild euphoria after a brisk walk along the shores of a majestic North Sea. All is right with the world and all brain synapses are firing correctly. Linguistic arrows such as subtle irony and litotes are ready to be drawn from the quiver.

My early morning consisted of making sure the coffee was transferred from mug to gullet without excessive spillage.
_________________
Bish a.k.a. Bish
Smoke me a kipper... I'll be back for breakfast.
I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Philip Banks
Je Ne Sais Quoi


Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 11046
Location: Portgordon, Scotland

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone know a coach able to teach me how to read a 105 polysyllabic word sentence? I've just had my 2nd near death experience!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Bruce
Boardmeister


Joined: 06 Jun 2005
Posts: 7921
Location: Portland, OR

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Conquering large polysyllabic words is like how it is to eat an elephant: on bite at a time.

Many have learned how to say honorificabilitudinitatibus - Shakespeare, William

And supercalifragilisticexpialidocious - Poppins, Mary

And the "longest" word in the English language is too easy because it's all regular words linked together: Pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis (45 letters)

Now some of the body's proteins are a joke to pronounce because they are nothing but string of the dozens of amino acids that each one is made of. Even scientists don't call them by their technical name, just their practical name.

Have fun.

B
_________________
VO-BB Member #31 Enlisted June, 2005

I'm not a Zoo, but over the years I've played one on radio/TV. .
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
George
Been Here Awhile


Joined: 09 Dec 2019
Posts: 283
Location: Seattle, WA

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bruce wrote:

And the "longest" word in the English language is too easy because it's all regular words linked together: Pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis (45 letters)


Huh. I didn't realize Antidisestablishmentarianism had been dethroned. Time to learn a new long word.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Bish
3.5 kHz


Joined: 22 Nov 2009
Posts: 3738
Location: Lost in the cultural wasteland of Long Island

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bruce wrote:
Conquering large polysyllabic words is like how it is to eat an elephant: one bite at a time.

I've found that a dash of HP Sauce helps.
_________________
Bish a.k.a. Bish
Smoke me a kipper... I'll be back for breakfast.
I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
todd ellis
A Zillion


Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 10479
Location: little egypt

PostPosted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

and a whisky or three.
_________________
"i know philip banks": todd ellis
who's/on/1st?

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    VO-BB - 19 YEARS OLD! Forum Index -> Chat All times are GMT - 7 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group