VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

Jacob Ekstroem · Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 9:39 am Post subject: Revival of a mic

I just fell in love with one of my old mics again. Here's the story.

Let's face it: if you simply WANT new gear, it's easy to find an excuse. It's easy to convince yourself that your mic simply does not sound the way you like it. I've tried this twice now, and both times it was my Røde NTK who suffered the consequences.

The first time was a question of self-deception. I had spent way too much time fiddling with settings on my pre and in post using plugins, that whenever I heard the NTK raw without any EQ or compression, it just sounded dull to my ears. I was actually convinced it was broken. Someone had a listen and convinced me it was fine; my ears were deceiving me into believing it should sound different than it actually is supposed to. Lesson learned.

The second time the decision was a little more rational. Being a tube mic it needs to warm up for at least 30 mins. to sound the way it should. This began to annoy me. And having it hooked up to a Tube-Tech preamp with seven lightbulbs in it didn't help, so I decided to ditch my tube gear for an all tube-free chain. I bought a vintage CAD e-300 which sounds very nice, but has too much self-noise. So eventually I tried something entirely different: a $150 Audio Technica AT2035. Wonderful little mic, and it has done a great job. Does it sound like an expensive mic? No. But it doesn't sound like $150, either.

Still, having a $500 Røde NTK just lying around seemed ridiculous, so sometime during all this I got my hands on a NOS Telefunken tube for the NTK. It made it sound like a million bucks, but still I didn't feel it was "the" sound I was after. Waaay to dark. Besides, I had just bought the CAD and really wanted it to kill the NTK (which at the time, I believed it did).

A few days ago I was in the booth. On a table beside me I have my "Mic Retirement Home". I swear, the NTK sat there and whispered to me; "pssst... you really still think that shitty lookin' AT-mic is better than me??!"
Okay, maybe it was just in my head... but regardless, I hooked it up today, did some tests and my, my.... that thing IS actually friggin' amazing. It has literally no self-noise, an insane low-frequency response and a much more crisp and clean top-end than the AT2035 has. For some reason my S's sounds a little muffled with the AT, the only thing about it I've never been quite thrilled about. It's more scoped in the midrange than the NTK, but so far I've liked this - however compared to the NTK it sounds "wrong" and cheap, almost like a dynamic. The NTK has lots of midrange, but simply more of everything else, too. Almost too much. They are often called "bright" mics - hah, not mine. Darkest mic I've ever owned, except it's dark without losing the presence in the top - does that make sense??

Anyway it made me make a decision. Easter is comin' up and I'll do some improvements to my booth, and then use the NTK for the time being to see if I can't live with the warm-up factor. If I need to rush things I can always use the AT.

The moral of the story being; if you want a mic to sound bad, it will. But that doesn't mean it actually does.
_________________
Regards,
Jacob - Danish Voice Overs (try it... it sounds really funny, too!)

Yonie · CM Joined: 31 Aug 2011 Posts: 906

Jacob, I think you just found the cure for cosmetic surgery in voiceover. All the time I was reading your post, images of actors looking in the mirror and finding "faults" with their faces were flashing.

It's so easy to take things for granted, or believe that something is wrong when, actually, you're making stuff up in your head.

Rob Ellis · M&M Joined: 01 Aug 2006 Posts: 2385 Location: Detroit

what Jacob said

in my case substitute "Gefell M930" or "Neumann U87ai" or "Brauner Phantom" etc. for Rode NTK

names may be different but the story remains the same.....

SkinnyJohnny · Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 2:04 pm Post subject:

My name is John Weeks and I'm a Micoholic...
Same story here and back to Gefell.
_________________
John Weeks Voice Overs
www.johnweeksvoiceovers.com

Leslie Humble · Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 3:16 pm Post subject:

Very similar discussions are probably in the files somewhere. But let's do a mic progression for everybody. Where did you start and what do you use now. If nothing else it will update the go to mics for everybody that you great pros use. I'll go first:

1. EV RE 20 (like it better than the 27)
2. Senn 421 (got some great recordings with this actually and wonder if the 441 is a great mic.)
3. Shure SM7B - hated it on me.
4. AT 4033 - like it a lot, still have it, seldom use it.
5. Senn 416 - still use it for Promos and Radio stuff.
6. U87ai - liked it okay
7. Replaced the 87 with a Mojave MA200 (MA200 is maybe more like the U67 Frank?) just seems best for my voice.

So in closing I use the 416 for Radio/TV and the Mojave MA200 for longform and non extra crispy stuff.

Where my pilgrims has your journey taken you?
_________________
There are rules to the Universe. Learn them and prosper. www.HumbleVoiceover.com

SkinnyJohnny · Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 3:58 pm Post subject:

Shure SM5B
RE-20
Neumann TLM-103
Sennheiser 416 (sold to Bob Souer who sounds much better on it!)
ADK Hamburg II
Neumann U87
Telefunken AK-47
Blue Bluebird
Gefell M930
Gefell MT71S
Peluso 2247SE
Brauner Phanthera
Gefell M940
Looking for a Gefell M930 (what is WRONG with me?)
_________________
John Weeks Voice Overs
www.johnweeksvoiceovers.com

Jacob Ekstroem · Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 4:25 pm Post subject:

Not that it's a long list but:

- AKG C414EB P48 (seems like I raised the bar from the start, but it didn't sound anything like expected on my voice; sold)

- Røde NTK with NOS Telefunken tube (see start of thread for the story)

- Groove Tubes GT67 (actually quite nice, but the tube didn't last long. A love/hate relationship; sold)

- CAD e-300 mkI (awesome mic when I tested it, killed a Neumann U89 and MG MT71 S for my voice, but is pretty noisy. Another love/hate relationship, but I won't let it go just yet)

- Røde NT-2 (Use this only for my radio shows, not for VO.)

- Audio Technica AT2035 (a fun experiment and surprisingly good for it's price. If I stick with the NTK as primary I may use this for radio instead of the NT-2)

(Also in my drawer: a pair of Sennheiser K3U's with ME30/ME40 capsules. Got them with some other stuff almost 10 years ago, haven't found any use for them. May look for an ME80 capsule one day, just for fun...)
_________________
Regards,
Jacob - Danish Voice Overs (try it... it sounds really funny, too!)

Frank F · Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 6:08 pm Post subject:

Leslie, good choice on dumping the AI. Now to get you to lose the 416... LOL

Yes the Mojave MA200 is similar to the U67 without the de-emphasis circuit which helps make a Neuman a Neuman. For one sixth the price of the U67 Mojave has created a good microphone for many VO gigs.

As for a list of my mic closet? It used to be longer with several hundred mics but since the theft of my studio it is down to these:

MXL 990 (Thanks to Rice Voice),

MXL 990 modded with Microphone Parts K47 capsule, electronic upgrades, and mesh mod, (Oh, and a new paint job to give it more of the right color);

MXL V69ME with NOS tube and upgraded electrolytics. (Thank you Greg Best), superb mic since the tube change with a U47ish sound;

Rode NT1A - modded with less screen mesh, upgraded electronics, and new capsule, (Thank you Diane Maggipinto) Another possibility for a "goto" mic since the modifications were completed;

Homemade U87 clone in an Ayurcle body with new transformer, electrolytic, Therish capsule,

Two homemade LDC's in 2" polished brass DIY body and TSB 2555A capsule.,

Two homemade "Alice" pencil microphones, slightly modded (no diodes);

MXL V67G fully modded to emulate a U87 with Tim Campbell capsule. This may become my really "goto" mic.

I am also putting the finishing touches on a homemade short shotgun designed strictly for VO by me.

Coming soon is a custom designed DIY U47 clone with a wooden body and a sound which puts the "ooooo in smooth",

Frank F
_________________
Be thankful for the bad things in life. They opened your eyes to the good things you weren't paying attention to before. email: thevoice@usa.com

Philip Banks · Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:57 pm Post subject:

Neumann U87ai

It picks up my voice and it sounds like me, within reason any mic does.

Dayo · Cinquecento Joined: 10 Jan 2008 Posts: 544 Location: UK

Hey Jacob - don't get me started!

I've had more mics than cars - and that's saying something.

You're looking at someone who had a pair, yes a pair, of AKG tube mics back in 1986, but sold them for peanuts because one was a little noisy and the other had a blown tube but I thought it might be too hard to find a replacement. Doh!

As an aside, even that that was probably not my worst piece of business ever. That honour goes to two channels of vintage Neve pres/EQs that I got from the old Rolling Stones mobile around 1990. Sold! I shudder to mention that with money raised I bought two massive 1 gig SCSI drives.

So my list of gear regrets is a long one. I think the lesson is; never sell anything! But anyway, I digress much too easily.

I'm glad you're back in love with your NTK. Most people seem to like it. Have you done tests to confirm it really truly needs a half hour warm up? Ten minutes seems enough for my tube gear. Of course, I don't have your mic, so I could be off whack.

But I was curious about your Tube Tech comment. They loaned me one of their pre's over Christmas and I must say I was impressed. The sound was just huge and more than a match for my VT1. They make some of the best tube gear on the market so I wonder if you had a faulty unit?

All the best

Smile

Colin
_________________
Colin Day - UK Voiceover
www.thurstonday.co.uk

Jacob Ekstroem · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:06 am Post subject:

Colin,

10 mins. may be sufficient, 30 mins. seems to be the rule of thumb, so that's what I practice.

I think you may have misunderstood my Tube-Tech comment. There was nothing wrong with it, I even put a few Teletubbies in that baby aswell, but
1) warm-up factor annoyed me, and 2) it was ridiculously overkill for my needs (it was an MEC 1A, same strip Don was using). It was a real steal and the prestige in owning one wow'ed me at first, but in hindsight it had too many knobs to mess with (hende my first NTK "issue"), so I sold it to someone who could utilize it much better than me and got the CAD mic and my current pre (Danfield MX10, friggin' awesome) plus some cash in the deal instead. Good choice for me at the time, only the CAD turned out to be more noisy than I had experienced in my test.

But yes, I'm SO glad I never sold the NTK.
_________________
Regards,
Jacob - Danish Voice Overs (try it... it sounds really funny, too!)

jasbart · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:07 am Post subject:

Interesting to read your NTK story, because I'm on the verge of swapping out my NTK with my original #1 mic, an AT-4050.

I originally bought the NTK as a #2 mic for clients (taking the place of a Shure SM-7). But after listening carefully to the NTK I fell in love with it, and have used it daily for some 7 years. My preamp, by the way, is an HHB Radius 40 tube voice processor.

Your story has caused me to do a more analytical comparison between the 2 mics. Question: should I be considering replacing the tube in the NTK? Same with the Radius 40?

Thanks, Jim
_________________
Jim Barton
Barton Voice & Sound
www.bartonvoice.com

Jacob Ekstroem · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:37 am Post subject:

Matto · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:40 am Post subject:

My first mic was the RODE NT1-A and I still use it today - I sound great on it and noone has ever complained or suggested an upgrade. I occasionally get self-conscious about using the mic that I started on, but one of my buddies reassured me that he got rid of a bunch of his mics (some at $1000+) and just uses the NT1-A!

I'm totally open to trying new microphones and buying one that really works for me, but I'm completely happy with the Rode. Tried the Neumann TLM103 and while it was nice, I found it to be quite bright.

I'd also like to check out this Rode-modding bizness...
_________________
www.mattcowlrick.com

jasbart · Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:04 am Post subject:

Thanks very much Jacob. I pulled the tube out of the NTK and it has no documentation on it...no label, no letters/numbers by the pins, nothing. Do you think it's safe to say this mic might have one of the Chinese tubes?

I'm not complaining about the sound I get out of the mic, other than it may be getting a little thin. Not brittle on the top (as many complaints have suggested) but thin on the bottom end. It's a difficult exercise, especially with a mic that's been used constantly for years.

Maybe I'll drop Rode an email to ask their opinion. All the best,

Jim
_________________
Jim Barton
Barton Voice & Sound
www.bartonvoice.com