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The "Lost" Voice
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Mike Harrison
M&M


Joined: 03 Nov 2007
Posts: 2029
Location: Equidistant from New York City and Philadelphia, along the NJ Shore

PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 4:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

melissa eX wrote:
I trusted the person who encouraged me to go deeper with it - and find that part of my personality.

Terrific.

And, if I'm not mistaken, this is what Bob teaches those looking to do animation work: don't concentrate on the voice; first find or create the character and the voice will follow. Priceless!
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Mike
Male Voice Over Talent
I have taken leave of my sensors.

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Mike Harrison
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Joined: 03 Nov 2007
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Location: Equidistant from New York City and Philadelphia, along the NJ Shore

PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 5:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

melissa eX wrote:
I trusted the person who encouraged me to go deeper with it - and find that part of my personality.

Terrific.

And, if I'm not mistaken, this is what Bob teaches those looking to get into animation: don't concentrate on the voice. First, find or create the character, and the voice will follow. Golden.

-----------

No, there was no senior moment, here. My first post duplicated (posted twice); the second of which had a means of deleting it. So I did. And they both disappeared. So I rewrote from memory and re-posted, only to find the original post didn't delete at all.
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Mike
Male Voice Over Talent
I have taken leave of my sensors.



Last edited by Mike Harrison on Mon Sep 09, 2013 7:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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kkuhlken
Club 300


Joined: 29 Feb 2012
Posts: 348
Location: Dallas, GA (Metro Atlanta-ish)

PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

melissa eX wrote:
But that place you have to find is not a sound - it's in you.


Thank you. Needed that today.

Needed this thread, actually.
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Ed Fisher
DC


Joined: 05 Sep 2012
Posts: 605
Location: East Coast, U.S.A.

PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lee Gordon wrote:
melissa eX wrote:
what I was fumbling around trying to say.


You fumbled nothing! What you said was brilliant and so clearly stated, even I got it. It's something anyone who thinks voiceover is just about having a great voice needs to absorb and understand. And it's something that can't be re-stated too often.


Agreed. What Melissa said was not only insightful and clear.

But eloquent.
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Ben Amos
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Joined: 18 Jun 2010
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Location: Atlanta, GA

PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's how I know that I still have a looooong way to go before I've "arrived," (if there really is such a thing, and if there is, I'm not sure that I want to get there, per se). The quest to grow and continue learning as a performer keeps you evergreen, in my book.

If I get in front of the mic and give something what is undoubtedly the result of my best judgement as a actor, and Bob Bergen looks at me and says, "Okay, that was good. But remember what your character is doing physically when we begin, and let that inform your delivery" and it turns out better - so much better that if you listen to the first and last takes, then it's night and day - then have miles to go before I sleep, because that last delivery isn't my first couple of takes.

With the lessons that I've learned through seeking to become a better actor, I'm constantly surprised by the performance that a solid director can pull out of me. Each time there's a "light bulb moment" at the mic, however, I remember that discovery. It becomes mine forever, so long as I commit to learning the lesson. Slightly better armed, I go to the mic the next time wiser. The aggregation of those light bulbs eventually contribute to the brightness of one's personal star. (Or so I choose to believe).

At some point, maybe those moments won't be as much of a revelation. My range will strengthen and improve, and the lessons learned from working with skillful directors and coaches will be internalized, so that it's first nature. Until then, however, you've gotta keep moving forward.

You're either green and growing or ripe and rotting.
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Bob Bergen
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Joined: 22 Apr 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 10:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

melissa eX wrote:
And, if I'm not mistaken, this is what Bob teaches those looking to do animation work: don't concentrate on the voice; first find or create the character and the voice will follow. Priceless!


Well, sorta. Let me elaborate a lil:

1) Every character has a voice. But not all voices have character. When it comes to animation, it's all about acting and originality in character. The reason most animation demos don't get the top agent's interest is because most demos, even well produced demos, lack originality. Same kid voices/old voices/valley girls/witches that the agents already represent. All an actor has to do is go to voicebank and research any agent's talent roster before making or submitting a demo. If your demo has anything in character(s) that the agent already represents, odds are you are wasting your time. You need to give em what they don't already have.

2) If you physically play the character the voice will follow. From head to toe, as if you are playing the character on stage, perform the character at the mic.

3) There are 3 things that make up a character: voice, acting, and a signature. Acting being THE most important part of the equation. Acting is being truthful under imaginary circumstances. The audience has to believe you!! But this is true for any performance. And, any genre of vo. Which is why even those of you who refuse to call yourselves actors or what you are doing as acting, you are indeed acting. And, if your read is believable, be it a commercial, promo, audio book, etc., you are acting well.

4) When auditioning for animation, think of the dialogue as scenes, not lines. Scenes have a beginning, middle, and end. And, there is also a scene partner. Although, most of the time the scene partner's dialogue is not included in the audition sides. So, it's up to you the actor to ask these 3 questions with every scene in the audition: Who am I talking to? What is my relationship with them? And physically/geographically, where is my scene partner within the scene? Most of the time none of this information is on the page. It's up to you to make the choices, even if you are making it up. Sometimes, it doesn't matter what your choices are. It just matters that you make choices. The mic is the ear of your scene partner, so where you are on mic from scene to scene corresponds with where your scene partner is from scene to scene.

By thinking all of this through, you will be acting and reacting. Not just reading lines in funny voices. You will show off aspects/layers of character and range in emotion. And (going back to what Melissa was saying) it won't be all about the voice. It will be about the acting choice. The voice will always be there. If you remember the choices, the conflict, the relationships, if your acting choices are solid and defined, you will organically have the same "voice" and be able to reproduce it all consistently and at will.

And, all of these same choices and techniques MUST be a part of your process when it comes to your character demo. If not, you are just recording a bunch of voices.

Incidentally, I work with a promo coach who goes through these identical (though paraphrased) techniques when it comes to connecting to the promo copy and making choices.

B
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Ben Amos
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Joined: 18 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, see??? ^^^THAT^^^

If every word of the above is old hat to you (whomever you are), then you're likely not in the market for coaching. Otherwise, get thee to someone who knows more than you.
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melissa eX
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Joined: 20 Oct 2007
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Location: Lower Manhattan, New Amsterdam, the original NYC

PostPosted: Mon Sep 09, 2013 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's a fantastic breakdown, Bob - it's a session in itself!

I think we all benefit from coaching, wherever we are in our careers. The right coach will help you to learn nuances later in your career that you weren't able to integrate - or even see or hear - early on.
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Lee Gordon
A Zillion


Joined: 25 Jul 2008
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Location: West Hartford, CT

PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ben Amos wrote:

If every word of the above is old hat to you


Then, you need a new hat. Nobody is beyond learning and improving.
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Dayo
Cinquecento


Joined: 10 Jan 2008
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Location: UK

PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 3:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice posts Bob!
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Ben Amos
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Joined: 18 Jun 2010
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Location: Atlanta, GA

PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 7:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I couldn't agree more, Lee. There are some that frequent these halls, however, who have been quite vocal on the VO Pro LinkedIn group about coaching in its entirety being a load of hooey. Though not verbatim, the impression that I got from their diatribe was that when they had to walk uphill both ways in the snow in their day to grace the hallowed microphone of "THE-uh BeeBeeSee-uh," that they got wherever they are by their own power - didn't need anybody's help, won't ever need anybody's help, and that anyone that does is a pablum-sucking infant.

Or so it seemed.

To have someone of Bob's acumen talk of the importance of continual improvement is a breath of fresh air.
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Bish
3.5 kHz


Joined: 22 Nov 2009
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Location: Lost in the cultural wasteland of Long Island

PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 8:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are two schools of though. These are usually applied to anything... not just VO. There are those who will tell us that "anyone can do anything they want". This has recently been reinforced by the positing that 10,000 hours of practice will make you an expert in whatever takes your fancy. This philosophy is usually put forward by those who stand to make a buck out of helping people on their way to their dreams (Voice-over for Dummies, anyone?). They also tend to talk of numbers far smaller than the suggested 10,000!

On the other hand (and this is where I fall), most will say that you need a foundation on which to build. Something apparent... or even buried that may need coaxing out. This (latent) natural ability needs to be honed if it's ever going to be considered as a professional asset. Some have an obviously good starting point on which to build... some find it buried. Either way, it needs to be treated with care and nurtured.

Sorry, but we're not all snowflakes full of endless possibilities. We can't all be anything we want (despite what the inspirational posters and self-help books say). For example... I am totally useless at sports. My hand-eye co-ordination is total crap. However much I may have wanted to (I didn't), there is no way I could have been a competent sportsman... or brain surgeon come to that.

As with all extreme positions ("anyone can do it", or "I'm a natural and I don't need help")... the truth is usually somewhere in the middle.
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Bish a.k.a. Bish
Smoke me a kipper... I'll be back for breakfast.
I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls.
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Ben Amos
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Joined: 18 Jun 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 8:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well stated as the voice of moderation, Bish. I imagine that the vast majority of us fall in the happy medium category.
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Mike Harrison
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Joined: 03 Nov 2007
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Location: Equidistant from New York City and Philadelphia, along the NJ Shore

PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bish wrote:
I am totally useless at sports. My hand-eye co-ordination is total crap.

I'm relieved to hear I'm not alone. But I probably have you beat, here, Peter; the only difference being I couldn't care less about sports. The world has enough athletes.

However, with regard to hand-eye coordination, I must say I wield a mean soldering iron. I impressed my high school electronics teacher because I'd been soldering for a few years before.

Getting back to the thread, though, we do possess the power to surprise ourselves (and others): at 18, I worked for a gas station that went beyond pumping gas. Tipping the scales at 98 pounds dripping wet (I was so thin, the joke was that if I stood sideways I could hide behind the stick shift of a school bus), I also found myself towing not only cars, but trucks, too... and also changing tractor-trailer tires... tires that weighed a lot more than I did.

There were also a few years as expert counter-man at an auto parts store. All the subtle differences between years, makes, models, engines, country of origin, etc. that drove others crazy were a piece of cake for me.

I'm also a self-taught typesetter, on one of the first computer photo-typesetters made (the Quadritek 1200, back in 1978).

(Must be the Asperger's, which I believe helps me understand technical scripts today.)

Point of all this: if we are able to tap our inner selves and use whatever's there, we can often surprise ourselves with our abilities and make them work to our advantage.

Wink
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Mike
Male Voice Over Talent
I have taken leave of my sensors.

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