VO-BB - 19 YEARS OLD!

Roar-duh · Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:45 pm Post subject: Tuuuuubes!

So I just scored a deal on an ART Tube MP USB... not much out of pocket thanks to credit card points, and I'm curious to see what some tubeyness will do to my sound.

I want to make sure that I get the most out of it that I can, and I can only assume at this price point that the stock tube is crap. What do you guys recommend as your favorite tubes? A stroll through the archives shows Avalon uses Sovtek tubes, but I also see mention of Mullard tubes and it seems that there are new production Mullards at reasonable prices. Maybe I should pull apart my 1960's Telefunken table radio and see if anything in there will fit. Gasp

Also, the manual calls for an 12AX7A, but it looks like a 12AX7 or 12AX7WA should interchange. Is there any benefit or harm in using one of these other tubes?

Thanks!
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dwpthe3rd · Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 9:26 pm Post subject:

This is probably as good a place as any to delve into your search...

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/geekslutz-forum/116542-tube-art-tube-mp-upgrade.html?highlight=art+tube+mp

Enter at your own risk Wink

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Bish · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 5:39 am Post subject:

I've played around with the tube on my V69me. I replaced the stock 12AX7 with various Mullard and RCA NOS (new old stock) tubes... and while I found that the sound was marginally/arguably improved, in each case, none were as quiet as the stock tube.

Enter Gearslutz at your own peril... it's a rabbit-hole and you will emerge days later even more confused! For some facts about tubes and their possible alternatives, I always found this place a real treasure-trove of information. He's a real tube geek... and it looks like a website from the 90s... so there's that Smile

Brent Jessee Recording & Supply, Inc - 12AX7
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Roar-duh · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 6:37 am Post subject:

Jason Huggins · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 7:06 am Post subject:

Just ask yourself how much improvement is actually possible with a rare expensive tube (that has a short life).

Roar-duh · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 7:43 am Post subject:

Lee Gordon · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:31 am Post subject:

If you scour eBay you should be able to find an NOS Telefunken 12ax7, probably closer to $100 than $850. I bought one several years ago and there's no way I would have paid as much as $100 at the time. They're often sold in matched pairs, so finding a singleton can sometimes take more digging.

Also take into consideration that it's going into an ART pre-amp, so it could end up being just a lipstick on a pig type situation. Gasp

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Roar-duh · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 9:03 am Post subject:

I completely agree... spending $xxx on tubes made from Unobtainium would be a little ridiculous for this. I found some NOS Sylvania 12AX7A's on ebay for $15 shipped, and it seems like that's worth a try. NOS, US-quality and at a sane price. Smile

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John Roorda
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SteveToner · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 9:14 am Post subject:

Oy, tubes...

I believe the ART uses what's known as a "starved plate" design, which operates at a lower voltage level than a "proper" tube amplifier. Apparently gives more tubey distortion, but doesn't really sound like a proper tube circuit. So it's an effects unit.

And if it's that distortion you're looking for, a free plugin could have gotten it for you.

As it turns out, most of what people traditionally considered "that tube sound" was a result of the circuit topology and the input transformers used in traditional designs. I'll try to dig up a reference on that if anyone is interested (and perhaps google-challenged)...

But still, it's fun to play. Give any tube a good burn-in before evaluating it. If you want to try swapping, look for a low-noise variant (something that might be hard to find in a NOS tube because even if it was a low-noise variant, at this point all the old tubes have pretty much been tested and the good ones taken). I'd be inclined to try a Sovtek 12AX7LPS (available here: https://www.parts-express.com/cat/vacuum-tubes/1600). And to answer one of your questions, yes, any 12AX7 variant meets the same basic specs, so would be interchangeable. There are other tubes types (e.g., 12AT7) that have the same pinout, but different specs. Some people try swapping those in as well to see how they sound...
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DenaliDave · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 9:48 am Post subject:

I just know how it would go for me...

I'd find some rare tubes and love the way it sounded. Then, down the road it would get harder and harder to find replacements. . . and exponentially more expensive!

Speaking of tubes, a lot of people are using tube amps for their digital music to give it more of a "analog" sound. Monoprice has a pretty attractively priced tube amp a friend of mine and I were thinking about trying out.
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Dale · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 7:21 pm Post subject:

John,
Ah- tinkering with that tooob sound. Have fun! I did the same as you, a few years ago with a very similar box: the older ART MP Studio. Also, I have and played with a Presonus BlueTube DP [retired], after hearing the good results Scott Pollak used to achieve with his.

As Steve mentioned, they are the starved plate design. I will not "lead the jury" with my experimentation results, and let you have fun discovering. But, I would be interested, if you care to share your results.

When I got tired of mine, those older ones would sell all day long ~$20-$25, on C/L, as a DI-box. I've seen many bass players giving those older MPs some love on other forums. I'm not up-to-date about the newer ones.
Dale

Frank F · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:58 pm Post subject:

Just a couple of things to set things right. It seems that slots site is always focused on one thing and it's not voice over and those who do you speak about the other things, such as music really don't know what they're talking about. If you want to talk about voice-over,come to this site. It's where voice-over people talk to voice over people.

Tubes are tubes, they noisy, they can be wonderful, and they can take the "grunge" away from solid-state pre's.

Frank F
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heyguido · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:59 pm Post subject:

Tube pre's can impart a special, vintage "warmth", missing from today's digital audio chains.

If you want the magic of a real tube pre, start with a Manley.

The ART is a poor, underpowered imitation... More distorted than warm.

As many here will attest, leave the processing to the producer. Ninja

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Bish · Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 6:09 am Post subject:

OK... I can usually join in and make myself understood. It's the ex-pat's curse... one is always right, but one is invariably outnumbered and has to smile sweetly and conform to the will of the masses in the quest for diplomacy.

However, there are limits.
I just need to put it out there... to say it once and have done with it... they are not tubes. They are valves.

Thank you.
I hope we can still be friends.
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Bish a.k.a. Bish
Smoke me a kipper... I'll be back for breakfast.
I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls... I will not feed the trolls.

Bruce · Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 8:54 am Post subject:

Tubular, dude. Tubular.

B (ala 1969)
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