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Just when you think you've heard it all

 
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Mike Harrison
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Joined: 03 Nov 2007
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Location: Equidistant from New York City and Philadelphia, along the NJ Shore

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 10:47 am    Post subject: Just when you think you've heard it all Reply with quote

Just over a week ago, an almost-new client (one who was involved in a job for another production house several years ago) said they'd like to put me forward for a pharmaceutical animation job. I do not know anything about the experience of the woman at the production house I am communicating with.

- Monday 11/7: She sends script and scratch track. Asks me to note the pace of the scratch track when submitting a short sample read. I listen to the first :20 or so and record my sample.

- Thursday, 11/10: End-user client approves my sample read. I'm told there is a "minor update" to the script and I'll receive it ASAP.

- I am booked for the session on Monday.

- Friday, 7:30pm: I receive the new script along with the advisory: "the video is only 2.5 minutes long so rehearsing to the match the pace of the scratch track is key." This is the first indication that I am to match a total finished length. (In my 39 years of narration work, no one has ever requested this.)

- The scratch track was recorded using the previous version of the script; the new script has additional copy. Thus, the timings of the scratch track are no longer relevant. So...

I've already given this considerable thought, and have provided my client with three options.

But I'm curious as to your thoughts.
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Bruce
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since you're doing a session with them listening live, the ball is in their court when it comes to the length of each segment. If your read is too long then you can re-read it faster. If it's still too long then it will be up to them to either re-write on the spot or make the logical decision to extend the video segment to match the copy.

I'm still amazed at the folks who cut the video first, then force the VO to try and match the timing of some office mate who rambled through the copy at lightning speed. It happens all too often.


B
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Mike Harrison
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Joined: 03 Nov 2007
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Location: Equidistant from New York City and Philadelphia, along the NJ Shore

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Their intent was to match the finished total length of the script. As the script contains several tongue-twisters, increasing the chances of stumbles and, therefore stopping the clock we're racing against, I suggested that each segment be individually timed and we could attempt to match those timings instead of trying repeatedly to match a 2.5-minute total length.

I'm waiting to hear their response to that idea.

But, yes: I don't know where this new trend of trying to squeeze the narration into already-determined timings has come from. I consider it working inside-out or, at least, putting the cart before the horse. In all videos using voice-over (not on-camera) narration, the narration *IS* the story they're trying to tell. They should concentrate on TELLING the story the best way they can... and then just add the pictures to it. DONE.

I don't understand the tendency to take simple things and complicate them.
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MBVOXX
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Joined: 03 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2016 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe I work in a different world, but it's rare that I get a script ahead of time. I usually receive script about 60 seconds before linking up with the client for long format narrations or a minute after we link up. Even on a scratch-match session.
I have one client that sends the night before, at the end of their day, for an early morning session next day. But almost every script seems to come at the last minute as they are still making changes up to session time. Commercial scripts are the same. Not unlike the days when we used to commute to studios for sessions...you arrive, they hand you the script, and a minute later you are recording.
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Quicksilver
Been Here Awhile


Joined: 29 Oct 2012
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2016 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I feel you pain.

I got a "revisions" brief from a client today for a VO for three 2 minute videos about online sports betting.

It was full of about 40 contradicting bullet points and vague references to possible copy changes, "towards the end" or "after the xxx part" His comments were over 1000 words of brain vomit.

Some of my favorites:

"In the part after intro in the second video, lets change the CTA to something... more direct, like xxxxxx, xxxx or maybe zzz,zzzzz."

"Have him pronounce the team names again"

"About half way through, after the parlay explination, change "good" to "the best""


What exactly am I suppose to do what that???

There seems to be about 5% of the population that assumes telepathy.

I despise these people.
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Lee Gordon
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Joined: 25 Jul 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bruce wrote:

I'm still amazed at the folks who cut the video first, then force the VO to try and match the timing of some office mate who rambled through the copy at lightning speed.


I have done a number of narrations that are English versions of existing videos that were originally produced in some other language. It doesn't sound like this is necessarily the case in Mike's project, especially since they have their scratch track.
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Mike Harrison
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Joined: 03 Nov 2007
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Location: Equidistant from New York City and Philadelphia, along the NJ Shore

PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's an update... an enlightenment, actually:

I did the session on Monday after the client supplied the new script with timings for each segment. I asked why the narration had to be so fast. The answer was something I'd never considered because I'd never heard of the need for it before:

The end-user client had established a "target" length for the video. It was, for whatever reason, not to exceed 2.5 minutes. My client said he had tried to get his client (a major pharmaceutical company) to pony-up for another few minutes and they refused.

I cannot imagine what would create a need for a video, especially a marketing or instructional vehicle, to be limited to a specific length. I don't mind speaking quickly (although it becomes terribly frustrating when the words just don't fit), but how can an audience of potential customers or employees be expected to fully appreciate, never mind absorb, what is being said when it runs past them like a sneeze?

This "target length" thing may not be the reason in all cases where we are asked to replace the words originally spoken by a caffeine junkie, but I have been wanting (and have begun compiling ideas and examples) to write a piece that explains to video producers and editors the importance of "doing service to the words." If the video content alone cannot fully tell the (detailed) story the client wants to tell (and few, if any, can), the narration IS the story.

If there are producers who don't grasp that, then it becomes a bit more evident that they hire VO people only because of the sound of their voices.

We need to educate these folks.
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DougVox
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike Harrison wrote:

I cannot imagine what would create a need for a video, especially a marketing or instructional vehicle, to be limited to a specific length.


Perhaps the production company charges by the finished length of the video, and their client's budget could only support a 2.5 minute video?
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Mike Harrison
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Location: Equidistant from New York City and Philadelphia, along the NJ Shore

PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 7:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That could certainly be. But, with the huge profits these drug companies post and some of the lavish perks they give their sales reps, I wouldn't think they'd be worried about another couple of hundred bucks for another minute or two of video length.
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Mike
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ConnieTerwilliger
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Joined: 07 Dec 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 9:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am producing a video (which I also wrote) right now for a group that does live training and has a limited amount of time to cram everything in. The video will be included in this training and they need it to be as short as possible in order to have time to show it and one other video during their half-day training.

But, instead of racing through the words, I made sure there were fewer words.

So, I do understand the need for a NTE video length. The educating that needs to be done is with the concepts and scripts.

But that is really not our job as the voice talent.

If we are getting badly translated scripts, then I think we do need to make the effort to help as much as possible, but for basic English that is simply badly written, well, we just need to read it the way it was writ.

I'm getting to the point where I won't even audition for something if the script is bad.

That doesn't help when you get a direct request from someone.
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Jack Daniel
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I wouldn't think they'd be worried about another couple of hundred bucks for another minute or two of video length.


Another (slight) possibility is that the production company was given a budget and for them, the 2.5 marker was all THEY could (or wanted to) afford. I realize this just pushes your argument downstream but I'm also confused as to what purpose a too-fast read can serve--unless obfuscation was the intent, which makes no sense in marketing v. disclaiming...
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Mike Harrison
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Location: Equidistant from New York City and Philadelphia, along the NJ Shore

PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was suggesting only that we try to educate clients that they shouldn't be hiring VO talent only for the sound of their voices. Many people have nice voices. What makes us worth the rates that so many clients seem to have a problem with is what we do with the words.

Edna at the beauty salon might have a gorgeous voice. But if she doesn't sound the least bit believable when reading someone else's words, she's no VO Pro. Wink
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Lee Gordon
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike Harrison wrote:
The end-user client had established a "target" length for the video. It was, for whatever reason, not to exceed 2.5 minutes.


Sometimes, you just can't know what the client's reason is for making a particular request. It could be that this video is intended to be shown at trade shows and some consultant has told them that research indicates 2½ minutes is the maximum attention span for booth visitors and they've taken that information as gospel.

I once recorded the voice of Mr. Monopoly for a talking game piece. I was told that the chips for these games were custom made in China to the precise length needed and the cost was based upon that storage capacity, so it was essential to keep each clip as brief as possible. Further, to avoid the set-up costs of creating an entirely new custom chip, I had to match the timings of the already created British version, down to the tenth of a second.
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MBVOXX
Been Here Awhile


Joined: 03 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2016 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bruce wrote:

I'm still amazed at the folks who cut the video first, then force the VO to try and match the timing of some office mate who rambled through the copy at lightning speed. It happens all too often.
B


This is how it's usually done with long format narration for the TV programs
I work on. They edit and lock all the video segments, cut the show to running length, then record the VO narration and place it then mix the final audio. The script has exact seconds & frames timings for each VO segment. Out of 4 shows I'm currently on, only one records the VO first, then cuts video to it, although they have a rough video cut already done for general VO segment timings, but that is tweakable to the VO. For the first couple of episodes it was always a problem trying to match the speed of the editor's scratch track since they don't "perform" it. But once the editor and writer get accustomed to MY pacing it all settles in to a synergy of sorts.
But for commercials it's almost always a scenario where the VO is recorded and audio mixed first so the video and graphics designers can cut and work to the audio track for creative impulse. Those who do it backwards always puzzle me but that doesn't happen very often, compared to yester-years when video editing was done on tape with slow syncing remote control.
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