VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

melissa eX

It seems over the last 15 years or so talent have been getting their shorts in a knot over whether they can/should/are-safe-to use clips from their work in their demos. You can finally untwist yourselves.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr-esq/demo-reel-clips-ruled-fair-use-directors-suit-actress-1306502?fbclid=IwAR3jKezcSCJVwiWcGWzhe5yiOTBrglLSfl3YVUUnpoABKRCmR8w2HgIMZlo
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Philip Banks · Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2020 1:00 am Post subject:

Legal point - It's your work. Your performance is your intellectual property.
Legal Point - Directors have sizzle reels (demos) too! No one gets paid for being on them.

During a Podcast someone quoted me when asked about good VO advice. Whilst I was quoted verbatim in an exact word for word sense I was not credited for my work, my genius, my life changing guidance. I was, of course, wounded to the core! Ok, I wasn't. Why? The Podcast wasn't about me, none cares and it was a spontaneous remark made to illustrate a point.

In our business we need to get a grip on the following.

Reasonable
Fair
You're not 5

Eddie Eagle · M&M Joined: 23 Apr 2008 Posts: 2393

Thanks for bringing that up Melissa it's a great point.

In my broadcasting degree cirriculum we studied entertainment law and the point that has always been in an actors benefit is that "As long as said media is used in a way that there is no harm to the IP and there is no direct revenue that can be derived from using said media with that actors performance... a producer has no legal restriction."

Bruce · Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2020 6:44 am Post subject:

If there are business or government secrets in the clip you share I can see a problem, but everything else should be fair game. I’ve always felt the second it’s made available by the client on the Intertubes it’s available for fair use. This legal case takes it one step further. Yay.

B
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Philip Banks · Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2020 7:55 am Post subject:

Carrie Fisher in a speech at a celebration dinner for George Lucas.

"He even owns my likeness! So, every time I look at myself in the mirror I have to cut him a check for a couple of bucks!"

Jack Daniel · Cinquecento Joined: 23 Jun 2016 Posts: 585 Location: SoCal

There is legal, and there is smart. For most advertising, including commercials, trailers, and the like, you're won't get any pushback for using already-aired materials.

But if someone has a deal with one streaming service, you can get in hot water if you "air" it on another. E.g., I shared a brief sports documentary on YouTube; it got a ton of views quickly, and then I learned that the producers had a deal with Facebook Live. They were kind, but they asked me to take it down ASAP, and of course I did.

Even if it had been legal for me to show a part of that piece for "demo" purposes, it would have been foolish of me to do so.

So if there's any doubt, I just ask. If they don't want me to use it for my reel, I won't. I'd rather have the relationship than an ephemeral feather in my oversized cap.
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todd ellis · Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2020 10:27 am Post subject:

Eddie Eagle · M&M Joined: 23 Apr 2008 Posts: 2393

Always good to ask first. Most will say yes.

melissa eX · Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2020 10:58 am Post subject:

My point in posting this was that it has ALWAYS been acceptable and normal for people to use clips of their work in their reels. But somehow over the last 10 years or so people newer to the business began to get paranoid about using publicly available work in their reels without written permission. There are a ton of talent who don't even know who to ask because they work through VDcon and the like and they agonize about it.

So the point in posting this, which gives the right to the actor, on a job that WASN'T publicly available, should set people's mind at ease for the work they've done that they've found on youtube channels or on ispot.tv - this should talk them off the ledge.

Obvs. it doesn't go for work under an NDA and I wouldn't advise it for non-published work either. But this whole paranoia about publicly available work?

Oh, and Philip, that's YOUR legal system. Here people will sue you for looking at them crosswise - and lawyers will take the case as long as there's money to be made. Nothing gets laughed out of court here for "reasonable". Someone sues someone for something stupid. Then they countersue for frivolous litigation and on and on and on.

todd ellis · Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2020 11:01 am Post subject:

agreed on all of the above!
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Philip Banks · Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:49 pm Post subject:

Frank F · Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:43 pm Post subject:

It never hurts to ask first.

Common professional courtesy is not so common these days.

I have been requested to NOT use snippets from several things and I have been directly forbid to say I was the VOist for other things (even though I was).

Is there an NDA? No. It is usually a gentleman's/gentlewoman's agreement closed with a handshake because they trust me. Government contacts are almost always a NO.

Other snippets, after requests for using the audio/video are usually met with a resounding: YES! It is good promotion for the client as well as you/me.

Legally, on either side of the pond? I have no idea. Morally and ethically: Ask first, shoot later.

Quoting Philip: "...we call that monumental stupidity".

We have a lot of that here. Asking never hurts and you might get a yes.

F2
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Philip Banks · Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 12:37 am Post subject:

I did a TV commercial some years ago and versions of it were posted on Youtube by the company. The advertiser was the sponsor of a major international football team and a Commercial Producer friend of mine is a huge football fan. Included in a comment on the youtube page "..and great to hear Philip Banks ..."

Within a hour my agent was on the phone and there followed an NDA. I hadn't told Andrew, hadn't told anyone and I made that clear. I looked at the company web site and read all about the production of the mega commercial, even the Assistant Production Accountant appeared in a very long list of credits. Me? Nope! The reason why I wasn't on it was obvious.

Also on Youtube there is a video showing how they made the commercial, fascinating and I'd love to share it for the benefit of the "behind the scenes" junkies but if I did that ...

Lee Gordon · Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 8:48 am Post subject:

Philip Banks · Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2020 9:36 am Post subject:

Ammdmnt 17b (Section XVIII) - Clause 9. The Oliver Cromwell precedent. " I beseech you in the bowels of Christ think it possible you may be mistaken."

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