VO-BB - 20 YEARS OLD!

kitstern · Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 12:14 am Post subject: Mic pre-amps?

I recently bought a JoeMeek 3Q (EQ, compressor, mic pre), here's the link: http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/g=home/search/detail/base_pid/187021/

I think I'm going to return it because it not only amps my voice but it also magnifies lots of room noise (unless I'm not using it correctly). My next major purchase is a vocal booth, but there's not that much noise in the room now. The noise doesn't show up when I'm not using the pre. Is anyone using a mic pre you're happy with? Are you using it in a booth? If not, does a lot of room noise show up in the recording? I have a Gefell cardioid condenser mic, with pretty low self-noise. Any ideas?
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Joe Whistler · Guest

What kind of "room noise?"

Is it ambient noise from outside getting in? Is it background hiss? One thing I've learned to look for is optimum gain structure. Make sure you have as much gain as you can get before clipping on the front side.

I think there will always be a certain amount of noise from the electronics, but if you've got enough gain between the noise floor and the signal level, you make the noise become virtually transparent.

If your unit has an optical expander, you can use that as a gate to reduce noise during quiet passages. From looking at the link to your unit, it doesn't appear that your model has an expander, but you should be able to get a good clean signal without it...unless your room noise is coming from outside the room.

Joe Whistler · Guest

One more suggestion:

Use compression sparingly. Ideally, leave it off, at least while you're setting up your initial structure. Compression is going to pump up your gain during quiet times, which is what you don't want.

kitstern · Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 9:42 am Post subject:

Joe,

I think it's background hiss. I'm a novice at a lot of this, but I did my own demo with the plug-in EQ & compressor in ProTools and never got this kind of noise. I adjusted the input gain according to the directions that came with the equipment, then adjusted the output gain. Is input gain the gain between the noise floor and the signal level you referred to?

Do you think I should give this another try? I don't want to return it only to find I wasn't using it correctly.
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Enjoy life, this is not a rehearsal.

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Joe Whistler · Guest

I'd play with it more. I went through the same problems with my set up. Too much background hiss means that the noise floor is too close to the output signal.

There will always be a certain amount of hiss, I think. Maybe others on the board can qualify/quantify that statement.

The idea is to get the noise floor pushed as far down as possible so that it's not apparent in relation to the signal strenth. If I actually knew what I was talking about, I believe I'd refer to this as the signal-to-noise ratio. <grin>

Look at your mic's manual and find its rated output. It might be something like -50db. On your mic pre, make sure you have compression off and all EQ settings at 0. This should give you a straight through signal from the mic, into the pre, and then into your A/D box.

Start with the input gain on the pre set at zero, and your output fader set at zero. Then start talking at a consistent level, watching the record meters on your software as you start increasing the input gain. Leave the output fader set at zero. Keep increasing the input gain as you talk until the meters peak around -3db. You'll probably wind up at +55db or thereabouts, depending on your mics signal output.

You may have alread tried all this. But it's the basics as I've learned them. Other thing to keep in mind is to be sure all your cables are balanced correctly between your pre and your A/D.

Let me know how it goes. Remember, I'm a rookie, too, and it's all part of the learning curve.

kitstern · Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 10:32 am Post subject:

OK, so here's another one. On another board I was reading a thread on mic pres, and most of the posters were saying if you couldn't afford a high-end compressor (at least $1200), the plug-ins that come with ProTools would be adequate. Any thoughts on this one?

Thanks for the hints. Maybe I'll go give Mr. JoeMeek another try!
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Joe Whistler · Guest

I think you need a "high end" compressor if you're recording tracks with large variance between "quiet" and "loud" sequences.

You should be able to get a relatively clean signal from your mic without a compressor, without an expander, and without using EQ.

Here's a link from my reference archives that may be of interest...

http://www.prosoundweb.com/studio/sw/micnoise.php

Joe Whistler · Guest

Kit:

What model Gefell mic are you using?

kitstern · Posted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 5:22 pm Post subject:

Joe,

It's an M930. Here's the link to the place where I bought it:

http://www.tidepoolaudio.com/gefell930.htm

It didn't cost as much as they have it listed for, I think I got it for $795, something like that.

Thanks for the link to the technical stuff. I'm waiting for a phone call so I'll go check it out.
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Enjoy life, this is not a rehearsal.

http://www.kitziestern.com/